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Post by babaoriley on Aug 7, 2018 17:21:23 GMT -5
part of me is on board with agedhippie. Deerfield could now be trying to extract as much ownership of MNKD as possible prior to flipping the switch for go time - basically restructuring whatever is outstanding and loaning us another 100mm. It’s obvious that one or more trolls are prowling the board here trying to sow confusion. Must admit they are very clever and educated. This is sophisticated white collar crime in my book. Perpetrated by people of very low character. But they probably drive Tesla’s and hive five each other over expensive lunches, laughing the whole time. Definitely not the type of thing my family has served and fought to protect. But that’s a free society I guess. Pat, I have to admit, I'm soooooooow confused, too! |
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Post by minnlearner on Aug 7, 2018 17:24:40 GMT -5
Mafddog365: Thank you for this thoughtful reply/statement.
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Post by babaoriley on Aug 7, 2018 17:26:52 GMT -5
yes baba, (I could not copy the quote.) this behavior, www.nytimes.com/2017/05/24/business/dealbook/five-accused-of-trading-illegally-on-health-policy-leaks.htmlThree current and former partners at Deerfield Management, a health care hedge fund firm, paid Mr. Blaszczak to provide inside information about policy decisions at the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, leading to millions of dollars in illegal profits, federal prosecutors in Manhattan and securities regulators said. www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/2017/comp-pr2017-109.pdfINFORMATION NOT RELEASEABLE TO THE PUBLIC UNLESS AUTHORIZED BY LAW: This information has not been publicly disclosed and may be privileged and confidential. It is for internal government use only and must not be disseminated, distributed, or copied to persons not authorized to receive the information. Unauthorized disclosure may result in prosecution to the full extent of the law. Okay, I'd seen that, I thought you meant relative to MNKD. Oh, I think most of those companies push the envelope and many burst right through it, so long as the AG and/or the SEC doesn't come down hard on them, they just keep on doing it. The industry is full of legal and ethical violations, and, of course, these boards are full of ethical violations. People masquerading as one thing, when they're another, and saying misleading things. Not so cleverly naming threads in misleading ways. All that crap, but, you know what, either we all signed up for it, or if we didn't initially, we have by now through acquiescence (hot damn, spelled that right the first time!!!). |
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Post by celo on Aug 7, 2018 17:26:56 GMT -5
part of me is on board with agedhippie. Deerfield could now be trying to extract as much ownership of MNKD as possible prior to flipping the switch for go time - basically restructuring whatever is outstanding and loaning us another 100mm. It’s obvious that one or more trolls are prowling the board here trying to sow confusion. Must admit they are very clever and educated. This is sophisticated white collar crime in my book. Perpetrated by people of very low character. But they probably drive Tesla’s and hive five each other over expensive lunches, laughing the whole time. Definitely not the type of thing my family has served and fought to protect. But that’s a free society I guess. Pat, I have to admit, I'm soooooooow confused, too! Whats wrong with a Tesla? I drive a Tesla. They are fun to drive. Charge it at the office for free gas. My character is not too low. Thanks for protecting our free society |
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Post by agedhippie on Aug 7, 2018 17:27:11 GMT -5
Not sure if you are short of MNKD. But to me your writing style is very similar to that of matt . What you wrote might be true. But in my view, your posts suggest that your thinking is very rigid and without imagination. Just like you had never though that Sanofi would pony up $50 million or so as settlement with Mannkind even though quite a few in this board thought that was very likely. I think you would not have thought Deerfield would loose the minimum cash hold last year to $10 million at one point. Similarly, I noticed that our famous bankruptcy expert matt yet again started to write about bankruptcy of Mannkind after he had wrote about it abundantly predicting mannkind to declare bankruptcy in thanksgiving 2016 and then by August 2017. My point is that yes, Deerfield has a covenant with mannkind that requires the latter to have a minimum cash hold of $25 million. Yes, Deerfield has the Danbury facility as collateral for its debt. However, given that mannkind has paid down the Deerfield debt to $25 million, mannkind has for the first time (since they secured their financing with Deerfield a few years back) the flexibility to do some major restructuring of the Deerfield debt, for example, by taking a new piece of debt from a new lender/investor, to take out the Deerfield debt entirely, or for the new lender/investor to take a second lien position to the danbury facility, with Deerfield remaining as the creditor taking the first/senior lien. Note that also Mannkind is growing its gross revenue/net revenue at 100% + annually. While we are not seeing hockey stick growth yet, 100% + annual growth rate is nothing to sneer at. I would say it is not so easy to find public companies whose main product has great market potential and its sales is growing at 100% + annually. I think Mannkind is on a similar growth track to that of Dexcom (at a market cap of around $8 billion currently) looking a few years back. As MK pointed out, when mannking is print $7/8 million a quarter by the fourth quarter, wall street will start to notice mannkind. I can assure you am neither Matt, nor short of MNKD (actually I have Calls which I bought in anticipation of STAT being better than it was so I am an investor again). My work requires that I think through all possible routes and outcomes, then work out the likely outcome. This means I am sometimes wrong as with the Sanofi payment because that was no logical, but equally I was right with the reverse split because the outcome was predictable, the $6 spike (almost, I held the last tranche of calls slightly to long), and that Amgen was not about to buy Mannkind. The minimum cash was reduced to $20 million as part of the June renegotiation with Deerfield. That $20 million secures both the debts and notes, and also the Milestone Rights. Even if the debt was fully settled Deerfield would still have first claim on the assets because of that Milestone agreement. That is not to say that Deerfield would not move off the cash limit, I think they probably will, but they are going to want their pound of flesh. A new lender/investor could appear, but the probability is heavily that they will not because the balance sheet is not good, and the revenue is a long way from where it needs to be. That's why I think Deerfield is the most likely lender. The problem with the growth is that it is from a very low base which makes it expected rather than impressive and missing the revenue target compounds that because it makes it look like the growth is slower than management expected. Growth becomes impressive when you do it consistently and with high numbers like Trulicity whose growth dropped to 82% this year on revenue of $678 million (before anyone asks I have no positions with any pharma other than Mannkind). |
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Post by kimi on Aug 7, 2018 17:37:30 GMT -5
Growth becomes impressive when you do it consistently and with high numbers like Trulicity ....sorry but wrong MNKD 100% annual growth for the next 5 years starting from $25 Mill = $25 Mill * 2⁵ = $800 Mill (US sales)
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Post by babaoriley on Aug 7, 2018 17:43:29 GMT -5
Compound, I can almost assure you that Aged Hippie is not Matt. Not to disparage the Aged One in the least, but Matt is a bit more sophisticated in his writing style. Aged writes quite well, though, especially when you considered he's "Aged" and a (past?) "Hippie." Many of those types might have trouble putting sentences together. On the positive side of the ledger for the Aged One, he's is less transparent than Matt, who I think has pretty much given up trying to hide his short agenda. The Aged One also has it all over Matt in his knowledge of diabetes, or at least in writing in a manner that would convince a bumpkin like me that he was very, very knowledgeable. As much as they both write, they make very, very few dumb mistakes. Commendable, really.
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Post by peppy on Aug 7, 2018 18:27:50 GMT -5
yes baba, (I could not copy the quote.) this behavior, www.nytimes.com/2017/05/24/business/dealbook/five-accused-of-trading-illegally-on-health-policy-leaks.htmlThree current and former partners at Deerfield Management, a health care hedge fund firm, paid Mr. Blaszczak to provide inside information about policy decisions at the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, leading to millions of dollars in illegal profits, federal prosecutors in Manhattan and securities regulators said. www.sec.gov/litigation/complaints/2017/comp-pr2017-109.pdfINFORMATION NOT RELEASEABLE TO THE PUBLIC UNLESS AUTHORIZED BY LAW: This information has not been publicly disclosed and may be privileged and confidential. It is for internal government use only and must not be disseminated, distributed, or copied to persons not authorized to receive the information. Unauthorized disclosure may result in prosecution to the full extent of the law. Okay, I'd seen that, I thought you meant relative to MNKD. Oh, I think most of those companies push the envelope and many burst right through it, so long as the AG and/or the SEC doesn't come down hard on them, they just keep on doing it. The industry is full of legal and ethical violations, and, of course, these boards are full of ethical violations. People masquerading as one thing, when they're another, and saying misleading things. Not so cleverly naming threads in misleading ways. All that crap, but, you know what, either we all signed up for it, or if we didn't initially, we have by now through acquiescence (hot damn, spelled that right the first time!!!). Quote: Oh, I think most of those companies push the envelope and many burst right through it, so long as the AG and/or the SEC doesn't come down hard on them, they just keep on doing it. The industry is full of legal and ethical violations,Reply; so illegal as hell and everyone is doing it? So are financier is/was mitigating, illegally with the help of inside information? Baba, is their a legal word for mitigating with the use of illegally obtained insider information? Just asking. it looks like a conspiracy to commit a crime to me. However I know nothing. |
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Post by hellodolly on Aug 7, 2018 18:56:09 GMT -5
Okay, I'd seen that, I thought you meant relative to MNKD. Oh, I think most of those companies push the envelope and many burst right through it, so long as the AG and/or the SEC doesn't come down hard on them, they just keep on doing it. The industry is full of legal and ethical violations, and, of course, these boards are full of ethical violations. People masquerading as one thing, when they're another, and saying misleading things. Not so cleverly naming threads in misleading ways. All that crap, but, you know what, either we all signed up for it, or if we didn't initially, we have by now through acquiescence (hot damn, spelled that right the first time!!!). Quote: Oh, I think most of those companies push the envelope and many burst right through it, so long as the AG and/or the SEC doesn't come down hard on them, they just keep on doing it. The industry is full of legal and ethical violations,Reply; so illegal as hell and everyone is doing it? So are financier is/was mitigating, illegally with the help of inside information? Baba, is their a legal word for mitigating with the use of illegally obtained insider information? Just asking. it looks like a conspiracy to commit a crime to me. However I know nothing. Baba, is their a legal word for mitigating with the use of illegally obtained insider information? Just asking. Organized Scheme to Defraud |
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Post by mnholdem on Aug 7, 2018 18:59:11 GMT -5
I sorta thought baba would throw out words like unjust enrichment and disgorgement.
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Post by sportsrancho on Aug 7, 2018 19:19:27 GMT -5
To me the settlement from SNY was very logical, we had them, they screwed up, so they paid up. Matt worked hard on it. Shook hands, moved on.
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Post by babaoriley on Aug 8, 2018 12:29:56 GMT -5
Okay, I'd seen that, I thought you meant relative to MNKD. Oh, I think most of those companies push the envelope and many burst right through it, so long as the AG and/or the SEC doesn't come down hard on them, they just keep on doing it. The industry is full of legal and ethical violations, and, of course, these boards are full of ethical violations. People masquerading as one thing, when they're another, and saying misleading things. Not so cleverly naming threads in misleading ways. All that crap, but, you know what, either we all signed up for it, or if we didn't initially, we have by now through acquiescence (hot damn, spelled that right the first time!!!). Quote: Oh, I think most of those companies push the envelope and many burst right through it, so long as the AG and/or the SEC doesn't come down hard on them, they just keep on doing it. The industry is full of legal and ethical violations,Reply; so illegal as hell and everyone is doing it? So are financier is/was mitigating, illegally with the help of inside information? Baba, is their a legal word for mitigating with the use of illegally obtained insider information? Just asking. it looks like a conspiracy to commit a crime to me. However I know nothing. Still not clear on your question, but you alluded to it recently, so I'll say this. In the context I used the term "mitigating" it's normal business practice. Mitigating risk is something most every lender does, in whatever way they can. DF did that with MannKind and I don't blame them for doing it or for bringing pressure upon them if they are not getting paid timely or fear with reason that they won't get paid timely. These are high stakes pawnbrokers, but they lent MNKD some real and considerable money and, to date, it has not worked out as most had thought and all longs had hoped. To the extent some of DF's funds are going toward paying Kendall, I think that's money well spent.
Now, the way you're phrasing it above, "is there a legal word for mitigating with the use of illegally obtained insider information." Well, first I wouldn't use the word "mitigating" there, I might use the word "extortion." So if one tries to make something better than it otherwise would be (mitigating) but is using illegally obtained info to do it, well sure does sound like something a DA or a US Attorney would like to hear about. Did you check out the story about the NY Rep, Collins, and his alleged insider trading mess? If true (and you can forget about "if"), it's another example of the fine people we have elected - and how "cleverly" they try to cover their tracks! What a crook and an idiot. But I guess, in addition to "mitigating" his own impending loss, he wanted to be a hero to his son's friends, who he no doubt touted onto the stock in the first place. Much worse than Martha Stewart.
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Post by peppy on Aug 8, 2018 12:39:04 GMT -5
Quote: Oh, I think most of those companies push the envelope and many burst right through it, so long as the AG and/or the SEC doesn't come down hard on them, they just keep on doing it. The industry is full of legal and ethical violations,Reply; so illegal as hell and everyone is doing it? So are financier is/was mitigating, illegally with the help of inside information? Baba, is their a legal word for mitigating with the use of illegally obtained insider information? Just asking. it looks like a conspiracy to commit a crime to me. However I know nothing. Still not clear on your question, but you alluded to it recently, so I'll say this. In the context I used the term "mitigating" it's normal business practice. Mitigating risk is something most every lender does, in whatever way they can. DF did that with MannKind and I don't blame them for doing it or for bringing pressure upon them if they are not getting paid timely or fear with reason that they won't get paid timely. These are high stakes pawnbrokers, but they lent MNKD some real and considerable money and, to date, it has not worked out as most had thought and all longs had hoped. To the extent some of DF's funds are going toward paying Kendall, I think that's money well spent.
Now, the way you're phrasing it above, "is there a legal word for mitigating with the use of illegally obtained insider information." Well, first I wouldn't use the word "mitigating" there, I might use the word "extortion." So if one tries to make something better than it otherwise would be (mitigating) but is using illegally obtained info to do it, well sure does sound like something a DA or a US Attorney would like to hear about. Did you check out the story about the NY Rep, Collins, and his alleged insider trading mess? If true (and you can forget about "if"), it's another example of the fine people we have elected - and how "cleverly" they try to cover their tracks! What a crook and an idiot. But I guess, in addition to "mitigating" his own impending loss, he wanted to be a hero to his son's friends, who he no doubt touted onto the stock in the first place. Much worse than Martha Stewart.
Baba baby now you are talking. "the word "extortion." Aug 21 (Reuters) - Hedge fund advisory firm Deerfield Management Co has agreed to pay $4.6 million to settle claims by U.S. securities regulators that it failed to maintain policies to prevent misuse of inside information, about three months after two of its partners were hit with criminal insider trading charges. AUGUST 21, 2017 The New York-based firm did not admit or deny wrongdoing as part of the agreement, the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission said on Monday in announcing the settlement. The extortion seems to have been settled. There is huge money in crime. They settled, no one went to jail? Mankind was worth 2.5 billion market cap in 2015. now what did we say 160 million. This settlement is like leaving the waitress a tip. www.reuters.com/article/usa-crime-healthcare-leaks/deerfield-management-agrees-to-settle-charges-related-to-insider-trading-idUSL2N1L7193 |
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Post by babaoriley on Aug 8, 2018 12:49:29 GMT -5
Still not clear on your question, but you alluded to it recently, so I'll say this. In the context I used the term "mitigating" it's normal business practice. Mitigating risk is something most every lender does, in whatever way they can. DF did that with MannKind and I don't blame them for doing it or for bringing pressure upon them if they are not getting paid timely or fear with reason that they won't get paid timely. These are high stakes pawnbrokers, but they lent MNKD some real and considerable money and, to date, it has not worked out as most had thought and all longs had hoped. To the extent some of DF's funds are going toward paying Kendall, I think that's money well spent.
Now, the way you're phrasing it above, "is there a legal word for mitigating with the use of illegally obtained insider information." Well, first I wouldn't use the word "mitigating" there, I might use the word "extortion." So if one tries to make something better than it otherwise would be (mitigating) but is using illegally obtained info to do it, well sure does sound like something a DA or a US Attorney would like to hear about. Did you check out the story about the NY Rep, Collins, and his alleged insider trading mess? If true (and you can forget about "if"), it's another example of the fine people we have elected - and how "cleverly" they try to cover their tracks! What a crook and an idiot. But I guess, in addition to "mitigating" his own impending loss, he wanted to be a hero to his son's friends, who he no doubt touted onto the stock in the first place. Much worse than Martha Stewart.
Baba baby now you are talking. "the word "extortion." Aug 21 (Reuters) - Hedge fund advisory firm Deerfield Management Co has agreed to pay $4.6 million to settle claims by U.S. securities regulators that it failed to maintain policies to prevent misuse of inside information, about three months after two of its partners were hit with criminal insider trading charges. AUGUST 21, 2017 The New York-based firm did not admit or deny wrongdoing as part of the agreement, the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission said on Monday in announcing the settlement. The extortion seems to have been settled. There is huge money in crime. They settled, no one went to jail? Mankind was worth 2.5 billion market cap in 2015. now what did we say 160 million. This settlement is like leaving the waitress a tip. Could not agree with bolded sentiment more. Hardly anyone, if anyone, served time after the 2008 meltdown, and there were hundreds that should have. |
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Post by sellhighdrinklow on Aug 8, 2018 15:44:25 GMT -5
part of me is on board with agedhippie. Deerfield could now be trying to extract as much ownership of MNKD as possible prior to flipping the switch for go time - basically restructuring whatever is outstanding and loaning us another 100mm. It’s obvious that one or more trolls are prowling the board here trying to sow confusion. Must admit they are very clever and educated. This is sophisticated white collar crime in my book. Perpetrated by people of very low character. But they probably drive Tesla’s and hive five each other over expensive lunches, laughing the whole time. Definitely not the type of thing my family has served and fought to protect. But that’s a free society I guess. They are the boiler room folks from the 90s. Exactly the same. They are 100% criminals. Jmho |
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