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Post by EveningOfTheDay on Nov 20, 2015 20:16:34 GMT -5
I think there could be a buyout yes if it gets to that point. The technology and patent portfolio is worth a non - negligible amount. I doubt we'd have any sort of massive 500% run-up from the news though as the buyout would reflect a specific price and the stock would naturally gravitate near that price (whatever it happened to be). I was not so much comparing the situation in terms of the numbers, but in terms of a sort of forceful takeover. When I look at the situation back from the point when Shkreli went to the FDA till now, most of the negative push could be construed as a continuos effort to weaken Mannkind to the point that a takeover is possible. At the same time, many of the steps taken by Al Mann could be interpreted as directed towards protecting the company from falling under someone else's control. My basic concern is that if MNKD falls into someone else's hands, will that group take it private, and if so what is the payout to investors might be, probably minimal. This would invite to a whole menu of lawsuits, but at the end might not matter, considering that I believe Technosphere, with time and proper management, could be priceless.
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Post by sportsrancho on Nov 20, 2015 20:23:26 GMT -5
trenddiver, I wish this were the case but I think it should be obvious at this point that us retails are simply along for the ride. Al and institutions owning so many shares make this a game where we have virtually no representation despite the fact this it is a publicly traded company. I doubt Al at the helm will equal more transparency, possibly the opposite; Al hasn't ever been very shareholder friendly, we are just a means to an end for him. Hopefully the new CEO will be both forthcoming and polished in PR (unlike Mr. Hakan, I'll never be able to forget his cringeworthy words during that last CC), we shall soon find out. Jeremg, I have spoken with Al at at a couple of shareholder meetings and I have to disagree with you about Al and his feelings towards shareholders. I believe he genuinely does care about retail shareholders because many of the investors in Mannkind are his longterm friends. In addition many of his relatives are shareholders. When you meet Al, he just seems like one of the guys (he even took pictures with the nurses ). He was always open and frank, sometimes to a fault. At the last shareholder meeting that I attended in 2014, someone asked Al a question about Mannkind and its future, And Al answered that Mannkind was about "patients and shareholders" and future was bright. I think Al believed this when he said it, and hope he still believes it. That why I'm still holding my shares. Trend So true! I know some friends of his that got shares before the IPO for 5 a share. They are 50% under water and still holding. He cares:-)
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Post by jeremg on Nov 20, 2015 20:24:21 GMT -5
trenddiver, I wish this were the case but I think it should be obvious at this point that us retails are simply along for the ride. Al and institutions owning so many shares make this a game where we have virtually no representation despite the fact this it is a publicly traded company. I doubt Al at the helm will equal more transparency, possibly the opposite; Al hasn't ever been very shareholder friendly, we are just a means to an end for him. Hopefully the new CEO will be both forthcoming and polished in PR (unlike Mr. Hakan, I'll never be able to forget his cringeworthy words during that last CC), we shall soon find out. Jeremg, I have spoken with Al at at a couple of shareholder meetings and I have to disagree with you about Al and his feelings towards shareholders. I believe he genuinely does care about retail shareholders because many of the investors in Mannkind are his longterm friends. In addition many of his relatives are shareholders. When you meet Al, he just seems like one of the guys (he even took pictures with the nurses ). He was always open and frank, sometimes to a fault. At the last shareholder meeting that I attended in 2014, someone asked Al a question about Mannkind and its future, And Al answered that Mannkind was about "patients and shareholders" and future was bright. I think Al believed this when he said it, and hope he still believes it. That why I'm still holding my shares. Trend I was in no way questioning Al's integrity and am not surprised by what you are saying from personal experience. I think Al is probably a wonderful man to his friends, family, and those who meet him in person; on the other hand, the abstract "shareholders" who once sued his management team and who are looking simply to make money off of his venture, I absolutely don't believe he cares much for them at all (myself included). I'm holding my shares simply because I believe what is in Al's best interests still aligns with my best interests as a shareholder. You have to remember we are a cog in the WS machine whether we like it or not (especially those lending shares!), and I wouldn't be surprised if Al has very bad feelings towards the whole idea of public ownership at this point.
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Post by mssciguy on Nov 20, 2015 20:27:34 GMT -5
I think there could be a buyout yes if it gets to that point. The technology and patent portfolio is worth a non - negligible amount. I doubt we'd have any sort of massive 500% run-up from the news though as the buyout would reflect a specific price and the stock would naturally gravitate near that price (whatever it happened to be). I was not so much comparing the situation in terms of the numbers, but in terms of a sort of forceful takeover. When I look at the situation back from the point when Shkreli went to the FDA till now, most of the negative push could be construed as a continuos effort to weaken Mannkind to the point that a takeover is possible. At the same time, many of the steps taken by Al Mann could be interpreted as directed towards protecting the company from falling under someone else's control. My basic concern is that if MNKD falls into someone else's hands, will that group take it private, and if so what is the payout to investors might be, probably minimal. This would invite to a whole menu of lawsuits, but at the end might not matter, considering that I believe that Technosphere with time and properly managed could be priceless. patryn after seeing what Shrekeli did with KBIO, hey, anything can happen. Can you imagine what Carl Icahn would do with MNKD with his pocket change? Split in two for sure, half maybe would go to SNY for a nice figure, the other half he'd probably split with Al and maybe us, if we were lucky enough to still be involved. @eveningoftheday I've worked in many laboratories and at this point, having seen all of the patents streaming out of MNKD, have almost considered offering my services as an intern there, even if it's just to manage their stockroom, seriously, just to see what's been done. What's been painful to a lot of us lately is no doubt the fact that additional capital has been raised at embarrassingly low stock valuations. It hasn't been much but it's been a step in the wrong direction. Technosphere development needs more employees, not less, and high caliber ones. There's just so much that's possible, we all know that.... by the way, great island profile pic, brings back memories. Have been to most of the HI islands, mostly on a low budget and loved almost every minute. Aloha from the mid west US, where first snow is expected tonight...
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Post by suebeeee1 on Nov 20, 2015 20:28:01 GMT -5
Shout out to Hakan...we would seem to be welcoming new posters here of late. If you had some time suddenly. Hmmm....not sure I want to hear from Hakan. What would he say? If it caused me to become crazy(ier) about this investment, I wouldn't want to know.
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Post by jurystillout on Nov 20, 2015 20:45:18 GMT -5
This is by far the best news we've had in a long time, Hakan has made extremely poor decisions regarding the sny contract, amph contract, prioritizing agenda's and negotiating with sny. The future CEO is going to have his\her hands full in trying to straighten out the mess Hakan left behind, however at least now the bleeding has stopped and the opportunity to heal is an option. There is absolutely no question in my mind that institutional holders let the board know that they have zero confidence in Hakan and if mnkd wants them to continue to hold shares they need to make a change. It's also very obvious to me that the TASE deal had Al Mann written all over it, I would imagine Al was not happy to have to come out of"retirement" to clean-up after Hakan. Whether the future CEO has good communication/pr skills makes absolutely no difference to me, we need a smart business person that understands the value of a well written contract, has vision and is actually a little paranoid about protecting the companies interests, Hakan had none of these qualities.
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Post by themarlin on Nov 20, 2015 20:50:50 GMT -5
Right, another reason could be he's 65, been with the company 10+ years, and if Valencia sold and there are no offices on the West coast anymore, he doesn't want to move. Very simple. I don't think it's that simple, because look at the stock price, but maybe it is.
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Post by mssciguy on Nov 20, 2015 20:53:39 GMT -5
Right, another reason could be he's 65, been with the company 10+ years, and if Valencia sold and there are no offices on the West coast anymore, he doesn't want to move. Very simple. I don't think it's that simple, because look at the stock price, but maybe it is. www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/vaccinogen-elects-hakan-edstrom-to-board-of-directors-300033504.htmlWho knows. I didn't know about the above until today. So, who knows? BTW, I emailed Hakan earlier this week and received a very nice articulate reply, not apologetic in any way. I think he's been dealing with a lot we don't know about, and I think we should all suspend judgement. After all, who knows, he may be a business partner one day soon.
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Post by EveningOfTheDay on Nov 20, 2015 21:06:34 GMT -5
@eveningoftheday I've worked in many laboratories and at this point, having seen all of the patents streaming out of MNKD, have almost considered offering my services as an intern there, even if it's just to manage their stockroom, seriously, just to see what's been done. What's been painful to a lot of us lately is no doubt the fact that additional capital has been raised at embarrassingly low stock valuations. It hasn't been much but it's been a step in the wrong direction. Technosphere development needs more employees, not less, and high caliber ones. There's just so much that's possible, we all know that.... by the way, great island profile pic, brings back memories. Have been to most of the HI islands, mostly on a low budget and loved almost every minute. Aloha from the mid west US, where first snow is expected tonight... When approval came and go without an offering, I simply thought "they must not need the money, good." For quite a while i was fooled by the estrange way in which they seem to conduct business, as if they did not have to worry much, thinking probably a deal with Sanofi was in place to sell the company, and that it was just a question of time. These days I am a lot more skeptical and think that probably this is as good as it gets for quite a distant future. 10 years down the road, who knows, but even if Afrezza survives, MNKD might not. That is a picture of Aneahoomalu Bay in the island of Hawaii, also simply known as A Bay. Beautiful place.
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Post by mssciguy on Nov 20, 2015 21:37:16 GMT -5
@eveningoftheday I've worked in many laboratories and at this point, having seen all of the patents streaming out of MNKD, have almost considered offering my services as an intern there, even if it's just to manage their stockroom, seriously, just to see what's been done. What's been painful to a lot of us lately is no doubt the fact that additional capital has been raised at embarrassingly low stock valuations. It hasn't been much but it's been a step in the wrong direction. Technosphere development needs more employees, not less, and high caliber ones. There's just so much that's possible, we all know that.... by the way, great island profile pic, brings back memories. Have been to most of the HI islands, mostly on a low budget and loved almost every minute. Aloha from the mid west US, where first snow is expected tonight... When approval came and go without an offering, I simply thought "they must not need the money, good." For quite a while i was fooled by the estrange way in which they seem to conduct business, as if they did not have to worry much, thinking probably a deal with Sanofi was in place to sell the company, and that it was just a question of time. These days I am a lot more skeptical and think that probably this is as good as it gets for quite a distant future. 10 years down the road, who knows, but even if Afrezza survives, MNKD might not. That is a picture of Aneahoomalu Bay in the island of Hawaii, also simply known as A Bay. Beautiful place. Oh I don't know about that... we've been beat up very bad these past few months but a some statistics and facts are clear, and here's a few: 1. Despite seminal insurance coverage, nRx, tRx, refills are all growing. This is just the US, a very difficult market for the moment, but even with 10-20% monthly growth, Afrezza has blockbuster potential in the US. 2. Enthusiasm in Asia and the mid-east, where obesity and diabetes are also epidemic... could take off in a heartbeat. MNKD has multiplied capacity, and is now a free trade zone that's able to import and export insulin with taxes, or soon may be.. 3. Sanofi has the pricing card, why not discount and go for volume??? According to some, toujeo may be have less return to SNY as early as Jan (due to license to LLY?) 4. Total absence of serious adverse events (at least that I know of) with Afrezza is a total validation and endorsement of Technosphere. It's not easy to watch your "paper value" drop by 70% in just a few months. I've had all the symptoms, sleep disruptions, stomach aches, cynicism, all of it, mostly fleeting. But I set up my google news alerts for my favorite search terms, filter out the noise and share what makes sense. And not just the agreeable stuff. BTW, have you ever been on some of those remote beaches (for example on Molokai) --- I have found some strange stuff wash up... old stuff from WWII, a vial with crystals in it (that scared me), all kinds of plastic shipping containers with strange language written. Very powerful to be in the middle of the Pacific and see all of that
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Post by mbseeking on Nov 20, 2015 21:53:12 GMT -5
I thought the chances of MNKD surviving were less 3 months ago. Company is taking real action to survive. 1. Layoffs. 2. TASE 3. Hakan. Does the future appear rosy.. no not just at the moment. But is the chance that MNKD (and my investment) still in play in 6 months getting a deal for Afrezza better now than it was a few months ago? Yes.
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Post by bloodrootfc on Nov 20, 2015 23:49:47 GMT -5
Hakan was, at the end of the day, a labcoat. Having worked with many, they are brilliant people with a fatal flaw: the inability to seal a deal. The mind of a researcher is simply incompatible with the mind of a negotiator or an executive. Decision making and strategizing require a different skill set from discovery and inquiry. In baseball analogy, we need a closer. Someone to put a few 103 mph strikes right over the middle of the plate to win the game.
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Post by bloodrootfc on Nov 22, 2015 13:59:48 GMT -5
Hakan stated he wants to develop lots of TS products with "partners". He also said he had one deal in the works for pulmonary hypertension. BoD probably vetoed his pulmonary hypertension deal and overall strategy. BoD wants a grand-slam, not base hits.
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Post by lakers on Nov 23, 2015 18:04:21 GMT -5
There will be an 8K filing this week on Hakan's departure by this Friday or earlier. BoD, mgmt, investors are equally frustrated with Sanofi's dragging their feet on Afrezza ... EU MAA has not been filed yet. Sanofi is still the sales/marketing partner. Stay tune ...
Please don't lock this thread. Investors deserve to know what's going on.
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Post by jeremg on Nov 23, 2015 18:19:47 GMT -5
There will be an 8K filing this week on Hakan's departure by this Friday or earlier. BoD, mgmt, investors are equally frustrated with Sanofi's dragging their feet on Afrezza ... EU MAA has not been filed yet. Sanofi is still the sales/marketing partner. Staye tune ... Please don't lock this thread. Investors deserve to know what's going on. Happy to finally hear what many (including myself) have been thinking from a reliable(?) source [on the inside]. Thanks for the update Lakers; if you don't have inside information, you'd make a damn good fortune-teller or medium, you should consider this line of work once this is all over.
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