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Post by op2778 on Jul 14, 2016 15:35:32 GMT -5
I'm not an expert, but looks pretty clear that Afrezza+Tresiba is the Holy Grail.
just take a look to patients shifting from Toujeo to Tresiba and using it in combination.
they need less insulin (both of them) and their results are amazing. They are living almost like non-diabetics.
Now, the question is: did NOVO see that or not? looks to me a good option to establish some kind of partnership-cooperation or whatever do you want to call it, in order to offer both products as a Combo.
Sanofi is in huge peril and If things doesn't change, they will continue to lose market share. (honestly I'll be very happy If they sink like titanic).
Good luck to all
OP
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Post by kbrion77 on Jul 14, 2016 17:13:19 GMT -5
I'm not an expert, but looks pretty clear that Afrezza+Tresiba is the Holy Grail. just take a look to patients shifting from Toujeo to Tresiba and using it in combination. they need less insulin (both of them) and their results are amazing. They are living almost like non-diabetics. Now, the question is: did NOVO see that or not? looks to me a good option to establish some kind of partnership-cooperation or whatever do you want to call it, in order to offer both products as a Combo. Sanofi is in huge peril and If things doesn't change, they will continue to lose market share. (honestly I'll be very happy If they sink like titanic). Good luck to all OP Absolutely yes, you don't get to become a powerhouse Pharma without being an expert on your competition. Big Pharma is still in crush mode with MNKD. Until Afrezza starts to gain traction and market share there won't be anymore possible partnerships. If Afrezza really gains market share Novo will flip the switch from evil to "we think Afrezza + Tresiba is the best solution for all diabetic patients". The bigger question is if MNKD can survive until that day. |
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Post by agedhippie on Jul 14, 2016 17:37:54 GMT -5
I'm not an expert, but looks pretty clear that Afrezza+Tresiba is the Holy Grail. just take a look to patients shifting from Toujeo to Tresiba and using it in combination. they need less insulin (both of them) and their results are amazing. They are living almost like non-diabetics. Now, the question is: did NOVO see that or not? looks to me a good option to establish some kind of partnership-cooperation or whatever do you want to call it, in order to offer both products as a Combo. We have had that question before. The answer is no, Novo Nordisk want you to take Tresiba and Novolog. |
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Post by mannmade on Jul 14, 2016 18:59:06 GMT -5
It is also my understanding that Novo is coming out with a faster acting prandial. Still injectable but faster than current, although not quite as fast as AFREZZA.
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Post by agedhippie on Jul 15, 2016 11:10:06 GMT -5
It is also my understanding that Novo is coming out with a faster acting prandial. Still injectable but faster than current, although not quite as fast as AFREZZA. FIAsp. It's not a lot faster than the current Novolog so I think they are going to have problems getting insurers to take it. |
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Post by mnkdlonginbrla on Jul 16, 2016 10:24:21 GMT -5
Novo understands the importance of PPG control. Looks like Tresiba has the FPG covered but Novolog lags behind Afrezza.
www dot novomedlink dot com / diabetes-videos / talking-points/ppg-a1c dot html
IMHO, Holy Grail = CGM + Tresiba + Afrezza.
Afrezza + CGM is the key to PPG control and the answer to an A1C <7.3%
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Post by daduke38 on Jul 16, 2016 11:48:47 GMT -5
Novo understands the importance of PPG control. Looks like Tresiba has the FPG covered but Novolog lags behind Afrezza. www dot novomedlink dot com / diabetes-videos / talking-points/ppg-a1c dot html IMHO, Holy Grail = CGM + Tresiba + Afrezza. Afrezza + CGM is the key to PPG control and the answer to an A1C <7.3% I seem to be in an unusual posting frenzy (Bad sprained ankle and limited  lol). But I think you are 100% right. Just hope the medical community wakes up and realizes this! I think MNKD would agree, also! Personally, from my research, I think you nailed it. |
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Post by agedhippie on Jul 16, 2016 14:55:53 GMT -5
Novo understands the importance of PPG control. Looks like Tresiba has the FPG covered but Novolog lags behind Afrezza. www dot novomedlink dot com / diabetes-videos / talking-points/ppg-a1c dot html IMHO, Holy Grail = CGM + Tresiba + Afrezza. Afrezza + CGM is the key to PPG control and the answer to an A1C <7.3% Everyone goes on about CGM but I have no idea why. Afrezza should actually negate a lot of the reason for a CGM which is to catch spikes and drops cause by insulin malabsorption. Since that problem is meant to disappear with Afrezza so should the need for a CGM with finger sticks alone being sufficient. The reason you see so many CGM pictures posted is because they have a pretty graph and not because they are necessary. |
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Post by tchalaa on Jul 16, 2016 15:36:25 GMT -5
Novo understands the importance of PPG control. Looks like Tresiba has the FPG covered but Novolog lags behind Afrezza. www dot novomedlink dot com / diabetes-videos / talking-points/ppg-a1c dot html IMHO, Holy Grail = CGM + Tresiba + Afrezza. Afrezza + CGM is the key to PPG control and the answer to an A1C <7.3% Everyone goes on about CGM but I have no idea why. Afrezza should actually negate a lot of the reason for a CGM which is to catch spikes and drops cause by insulin malabsorption. Since that problem is meant to disappear with Afrezza so should the need for a CGM with finger sticks alone being sufficient. The reason you see so many CGM pictures posted is because they have a pretty graph and not because they are necessary. If you recall Mike Castagna made the promotion of a petition on CGM. The point is rapidity with which Afrezza, since while monitoring you can react by taking Afrezza to save your life or prevent by taking it and observe how everything is well. This is the reason why CGM is so important today win-win situation Afrezza is safe and ultra-rapid |
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Post by sportsrancho on Jul 16, 2016 15:50:33 GMT -5
Everyone goes on about CGM but I have no idea why. Afrezza should actually negate a lot of the reason for a CGM which is to catch spikes and drops cause by insulin malabsorption. Since that problem is meant to disappear with Afrezza so should the need for a CGM with finger sticks alone being sufficient. The reason you see so many CGM pictures posted is because they have a pretty graph and not because they are necessary. If you recall Mike Castagna made the promotion of a petition on CGM. The point is rapidity with which Afrezza, since while monitoring you can react by taking Afrezza to save your life or prevent by taking it and observe how everything is well. This is the reason why CGM is so important today win-win situation Afrezza is safe and ultra-rapid That completely slipped my mind:-(. He did, and you are so right! |
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Post by mnkdlonginbrla on Jul 16, 2016 17:26:55 GMT -5
Try driving your car on a 12 hour trip and only look at your speed 3X. Good Luck.
In order to properly control something the value, direction and rate must be known.
CGM is an integral part of real time PPG control with Afrezza.
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Post by agedhippie on Jul 16, 2016 17:55:31 GMT -5
Everyone goes on about CGM but I have no idea why. Afrezza should actually negate a lot of the reason for a CGM which is to catch spikes and drops cause by insulin malabsorption. Since that problem is meant to disappear with Afrezza so should the need for a CGM with finger sticks alone being sufficient. The reason you see so many CGM pictures posted is because they have a pretty graph and not because they are necessary. If you recall Mike Castagna made the promotion of a petition on CGM. The point is rapidity with which Afrezza, since while monitoring you can react by taking Afrezza to save your life or prevent by taking it and observe how everything is well. This is the reason why CGM is so important today win-win situation Afrezza is safe and ultra-rapid That petition was very specific - it was to allow Dexcom to state on their label that a CGM with the 505 or later firmware was accurate enough to dose from without the use of fingersticks. People don't seem to understand how you use a CGM so here goes  CGMs are useful to detect fast changes, low numbers, and direction. High numbers as well but they don't get as much attention. I want it to tell me if I am heading for a hypo so I have an alarm set at 75 (CGMs lag real numbers so you want it slightly high), and another set at 200. I have alarms set for three up arrows (levels rising very fast) or two down arrows (dropping fast). The only time I actually look at my CGM is when I dose as there is no point otherwise - if the alarms haven't tripped I am in the zone so there is nothing to do. Now according to social media Afrezza gets rid of those peaks and troughs that make insulin such a delight to use. In that case the alarms will never trip, the ability to do 'near enough' dosing gets rid of the directional adjustment - why exactly do I need a CGM? I say this as a CGM user. This is a potential selling point to insurers - put patients on Afrezza and claw back the CGM costs. |
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Post by agedhippie on Jul 16, 2016 18:12:00 GMT -5
Try driving your car on a 12 hour trip and only look at your speed 3X. Good Luck. In order to properly control something the value, direction and rate must be known. CGM is an integral part of real time PPG control with Afrezza. If you want to use a car as an analogy the fuel gauge is a better choice. Do you drive with looking at the fuel gauge the whole time or just occasionally when you think you may need to top up? People are seriously confused about the life of a diabetic. As diabetics our role is not to deal with my diabetes in real time, if it was I would shoot myself now. You do not spend your time looking at your CGM - you only look if you feel something is wrong or an alarm goes off. I say this as a long time CGM user. |
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Post by mnkdlonginbrla on Jul 17, 2016 8:01:48 GMT -5
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Post by agedhippie on Jul 17, 2016 9:57:26 GMT -5
There seems to be this idea that food makes levels change rapidly - they don't unless you are eating refined sugar (even glucose tablets take 15 minutes). On to slide 6 - that data is true for Type 2 only if you read the whole paper and Type 2 do not get CGMs. If you want to see how CGMs are used look at my earlier reply to tchalaa in this thread. I still think the fuel gauge is a better analogy, people don't spend their life watch their CGM. |
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lol). But I think you are 100% right. Just hope the medical community wakes up and realizes this! I think MNKD would agree, also! Personally, from my research, I think you nailed it.
