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Post by chuck on Feb 13, 2017 13:43:52 GMT -5
Today's proxy as compared to last year's proxy with data from Mar 21/16 show that Mann affiliated entities did the following:
Biomed Partners I and II LLC - sold 100% Mannco LLC - sold 100% AGC Trust - sold 100% CGM Trust - sold 100% The Mann Group LLC - sold less than 1% Alfred E. Mann Living Trust - sold 49%
In total the Mann affiliated entities sold 42,773,052 shares, or 27.3% of their position. Their current position consists of 114,102,161 shares (23.7% of total shares issued and outstanding) broken down by the following entities:
The Mann Group LLC - 89,750,000 Alfred E. Mann Living Trust - 20,798,469 Employee stock options - 3,651,442
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 13:47:40 GMT -5
and for all the folks.. The Mann Group LLC(1) 89,652,250 18.7 % The Alfred E. Mann Living Trust(2) 114,102,161 23.7 % (1) The Alfred E. Mann Living Trust (the “Trust”) is the sole member and manager of The Mann Group LLC (“The Mann Group”). (2) Includes (i) the shares described in footnote (1) above, (ii) 20,798,469 shares held of record by the Trust and (iii) 3,651,442 shares which the Trust has the right to acquire within 60 days of February 1, 2017 pursuant to the exercise of outstanding options previously held by Alfred E. Mann prior to his passing. try to calculate the %age of 478,637,095 shares outstanding with 114,102,161 shares and it comes to ? 23.7% do numbers argue?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 13:51:10 GMT -5
Today's proxy as compared to last year's proxy with data from Mar 21/16 show that Mann affiliated entities did the following: Biomed Partners I and II LLC - sold 100% Mannco LLC - sold 100% AGC Trust - sold 100% CGM Trust - sold 100% The Mann Group LLC - sold less than 1% Alfred E. Mann Living Trust - sold 49% In total the Mann affiliated entities sold 42,773,052 shares, or 27.3% of their position. Their current position consists of 114,102,161 shares (23.7% of total shares issued and outstanding) broken down by the following entities: The Mann Group LLC - 89,750,000 Alfred E. Mann Living Trust - 20,798,469 Employee stock options - 3,651,442 but but but dont they own 203 mil shares?
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Post by chuck on Feb 13, 2017 14:00:08 GMT -5
No they don't. Mann and his companies position in mnkd over the past 5 years is as follows:
2013 - 167m 2014 - 153m 2015 - 154m 2016 - 156m 2017 - 114m
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 14:07:12 GMT -5
No they don't. Mann and his companies position in mnkd over the past 5 years is as follows: 2013 - 167m 2014 - 153m 2015 - 154m 2016 - 156m 2017 - 114m you just broke numbers and math to few folks here ..possibly setting up yourself to be a fudster and argue-er.
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Post by therealisaching on Feb 13, 2017 14:12:23 GMT -5
and for all the folks.. The Mann Group LLC(1) 89,652,250 18.7 % The Alfred E. Mann Living Trust(2) 114,102,161 23.7 % (1) The Alfred E. Mann Living Trust (the “Trust”) is the sole member and manager of The Mann Group LLC (“The Mann Group”). (2) Includes (i) the shares described in footnote (1) above, (ii) 20,798,469 shares held of record by the Trust and (iii) 3,651,442 shares which the Trust has the right to acquire within 60 days of February 1, 2017 pursuant to the exercise of outstanding options previously held by Alfred E. Mann prior to his passing. try to calculate the %age of 478,637,095 shares outstanding with 114,102,161 shares and it comes to ? 23.7% do numbers argue?iam2
I follow your logic. #1 is included in #2. That wasnt clear to me reviewing this morning.
Having said that if we exclude shares that havent been purchased yet & divide by issued & o/s it would take the ownership % down to 18.7%.
It was 27.7% on the last 10Q.
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Post by kbrion77 on Feb 13, 2017 14:12:39 GMT -5
No they don't. Mann and his companies position in mnkd over the past 5 years is as follows: 2013 - 167m 2014 - 153m 2015 - 154m 2016 - 156m 2017 - 114m Hmmm looks to be exact opposite of shareholders averaging and doubling down.......
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Post by derek2 on Feb 13, 2017 14:13:10 GMT -5
Since you prefer to argue instead of looking at the numbers.. 3/21/2016 total shares reported: ~153M disclaimers total # of shares: ~25M total: ~178M total shares controlled from the numbers you listed in today's filing above: ~204M difference (aka how many shares the trust purchase since last disclosure) - ~26M based on the foot notes , I understand that 114,102,161 shares owned by living trust includes 89,652,250 shares of the Manngroup? 89,652,250 + 20,798,469 + 3,651,442 = 114,102,161 is my math wrong? You're correct. This is a basic error that occurs year after year.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 14:14:49 GMT -5
and for all the folks.. The Mann Group LLC(1) 89,652,250 18.7 % The Alfred E. Mann Living Trust(2) 114,102,161 23.7 % (1) The Alfred E. Mann Living Trust (the “Trust”) is the sole member and manager of The Mann Group LLC (“The Mann Group”). (2) Includes (i) the shares described in footnote (1) above, (ii) 20,798,469 shares held of record by the Trust and (iii) 3,651,442 shares which the Trust has the right to acquire within 60 days of February 1, 2017 pursuant to the exercise of outstanding options previously held by Alfred E. Mann prior to his passing. try to calculate the %age of 478,637,095 shares outstanding with 114,102,161 shares and it comes to ? 23.7% do numbers argue?iam2
I follow your logic. #1 is included in #2. That wasnt clear to me reviewing this morning.
Having said that if we exclude shares that havent been purchased yet & divide by issued & o/s it would take the ownership % down to 18.7%.
It was 27.7% on the last 10Q.
would dilution of 50 mil shares bring the 27.7% down to 23.7%? I am not calculating and dont have the intention. I am just guessing.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 14:16:00 GMT -5
based on the foot notes , I understand that 114,102,161 shares owned by living trust includes 89,652,250 shares of the Manngroup? 89,652,250 + 20,798,469 + 3,651,442 = 114,102,161 is my math wrong? You're correct. This is a basic error that occurs year after year. #Alternativefacts?
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Post by therealisaching on Feb 13, 2017 14:22:14 GMT -5
iam2
I follow your logic. #1 is included in #2. That wasnt clear to me reviewing this morning.
Having said that if we exclude shares that havent been purchased yet & divide by issued & o/s it would take the ownership % down to 18.7%.
It was 27.7% on the last 10Q.
would dilution of 50 mil shares bring the 27.7% down to 23.7%? I am not calculating and dont have the intention. I am just guessing. No they were 32% at 6/30 & the dilution took them down to 27.7 without selling last year.
I think Chuck sums it up correctly a few posts up. There was some selling.
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Post by me on Feb 13, 2017 14:22:55 GMT -5
for folks who dont pay attention to disclaimers The Mann Group LLC(1) 89,652,250 18.7 % The Alfred E. Mann Living Trust(2) 114,102,161 23.7 % (1) The Alfred E. Mann Living Trust (the “Trust”) is the sole member and manager of The Mann Group LLC (“The Mann Group”). (2) Includes (i) the shares described in footnote (1) above, (ii) 20,798,469 shares held of record by the Trust and (iii) 3,651,442 shares which the Trust has the right to acquire within 60 days of February 1, 2017 pursuant to the exercise of outstanding options previously held by Alfred E. Mann prior to his passing. Since you prefer to argue instead of looking at the numbers.. 3/21/2016 total shares reported: ~153M disclaimers total # of shares: ~25M total: ~178M total shares controlled from the numbers you listed in today's filing above: ~204M difference (aka how many shares the trust purchase since last disclosure) - ~26M You're misreading the documents. The total owned now is 114mm, which is less than prior reporting. Edit: Sorry, multiple corrections to this already.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2017 14:23:59 GMT -5
No they don't. Mann and his companies position in mnkd over the past 5 years is as follows: 2013 - 167m 2014 - 153m 2015 - 154m 2016 - 156m 2017 - 114m Hmmm looks to be exact opposite of shareholders averaging and doubling down....... but they have held steady until Mann lived. Looks like the trust dont share the same view as Mann. The trust management got to feed themselves?
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Post by silentknight on Feb 13, 2017 14:50:36 GMT -5
Hmmm looks to be exact opposite of shareholders averaging and doubling down....... but they have held steady until Mann lived. Looks like the trust dont share the same view as Mann. The trust management got to feed themselves? In 2014, the Trust's shares were worth $1.6 billion dollars after approval. Today, they're worth $65.5 million and change. I'm thinking the Trust is getting tired of seeing their money disintegrate like the rest of us which is why you see them selling.
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Post by madog365 on Feb 13, 2017 15:01:10 GMT -5
No they don't. Mann and his companies position in mnkd over the past 5 years is as follows: 2013 - 167m 2014 - 153m 2015 - 154m 2016 - 156m 2017 - 114m you just broke numbers and math to few folks here ..possibly setting up yourself to be a fudster and argue-er. You're right and i misread the filing (which i still think is a confusing way to denote total ownership). Touche. Not above admitting when i'm wrong.
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