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Post by zuegirdor on Nov 7, 2017 19:07:38 GMT -5
I was just on the phone to my supplier (we get Afrezza delivered to our door). I had ordered next months supply Monday and he said it would be here thursday. But then he called with the bad news. He felt awful and we commiserated -speculating that Foremost may be sabotaging on BPs behalf. this is a tragedy for my family. Will be calling Mannkind tomorrow. I saw in the shoutbox some one mentioning titration and that everyone is using 12u's. What was said in the conference call about that? It is our expereince that son needs a titration pack and a half to get through the month. so we just tough it out with Humalog for the last 10 days since we cannot afford it as it is. Either the stock goes through the roof and i sue the proceeds to keep son on Afrezza full time or we will only be able to keep him on it for 10 days a month. Not very encouraging. Burn rate is killing us. the group was commenting on this slide. the % raising quickly with an increase from low numbers.
The take home of that graphic is that it takes A LOT MORE Afrezza to get the job done than any one knew. User Expereince has taught them. they need to build taht inot their pricing, affordability and marketability assumptions. My son needs one and a half titration packs at $1200 per unit = $1800. there is no way we can afford that. MOst people cannot afford that. Its just not going to catch on at that price. I will be forhtcoming with all in a way I was not before. Now it is time. When we first started using Afrezza we were not prepared for how much my son would need. It has taken us a good 9 months to "titrate" correctly. My son is doing great now. we have a chance to get him below 6.0 at his endo appointment on thursday the 9th of November. We shall see. But after the first month I had my doubts about the product and considered giving it up because he was still dealing with the cough and he need more Afrezza than we thought. He would take an 8 and then a 4 follow up and it was not enough. The regular pack of 90 8u and 90 4u will only cover about 45 meals with enough left over for the inevitable correction and snacks. I don't know about you but we eat 90 meals a month. We have had to use humalog about half the time to make up for the shortfall. So its hard to credit Afrezza for all of his improved blood sugar numbers. that is why I am not bragging on twitter with shots of his CGM all the time. Afrezza works great and this month we bought extra because we wanted him to use it full time to get the best a1c for the upcoming appointment with his endo. But the reality is that it has taken along time to learn. Getting the "non-linear" priced titration packs was the key, or I should say getting the 12's and a 1440 unit supply instead of the standard 1080unit supply was key. But it does not make much sense for our family at the new price.
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Post by cjm18 on Nov 7, 2017 19:07:53 GMT -5
Anybody think we just maybe need to reintroduce market transparency to healthcare? Government involvement has so distorted the healthcare market that no one has any idea what products and services really cost. Or the govt can require some transparency. Where's the incentive to disclose pricing.
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Post by peppy on Nov 7, 2017 19:08:30 GMT -5
I wonder if that has to do with the "linearizing" of the pricing that was talked about. Mike did make clear that they aren't desiring to give away long term profits that they think they can eventually get from insurers by agreeing/offering lowering pricing now. Whatever the cause, hate that it impacts your family so much. Wonder if someone with contacts into Mannkind might be able to appeal for some voucher coverage for you? Is that the price after the discount card, or is there some reason you can't use that? I probably should refrain from talking too much right now. I question the wisdom of the price structure. It takes way more Afrezza units than Humalog units to get the job done. They acknowledge this. There is NO PRICE COMPARISON between humalog and Afrezza. My son needed $280 worth of Humalog a month which cost us $20 with our insurance. He needs $1800 worth of Afrezza. Mike must be awfully confident that he's got a windfall. I think that is delusional. We are talking Shkreli delusional! Insurance it's self seems delusional. Pay to have the price reduced. two different prices, what insurance pays. what companies charge.
a hospital stay, $240,000 with out insurance. With insurance, the insurance company pays 74,000 and the payment is settled.
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Post by zuegirdor on Nov 7, 2017 19:08:43 GMT -5
I probably should refrain from talking too much right now. I question the wisdom of the price structure. It takes way more Afrezza units than Humalog units to get the job done. They acknowledge this. There is NO PRICE COMPARISON between humalog and Afrezza. My son needed $280 worth of Humalog a month which cost us $20 with our insurance. He needs $1800 worth of Afrezza. Mike must be awfully confident that he's got a windfall. I think that is delusional. We are talking Shkreli delusional! Afrezza Patient Savings Card
MannKind Cares 1-844-3AFREZZA Have you called around to make sure your son is with the best insurer available? We have one on file but cannot use it since he is not 18. That will sure help us come next March
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Post by mango on Nov 7, 2017 19:12:12 GMT -5
Hate to rain on the parade but I cannot figure out why my cost for the titration pack was just raised TODAY from 800 to $1200. How the hell is MNKD and Afrezza gonna get people to try this at this ridiculous price, when its barely covered by insurance for most people already?Am I the first and or only person to learn of this horrific development? What is up with this 50% price raise? Is Foremost McKesson trying to kill Afrezza? Help. I cannot afford it for my son at that price! Have you asked your health insurance company why they will not provide coverage for Afrezza?
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Post by mango on Nov 7, 2017 19:16:17 GMT -5
Anybody think we just maybe need to reintroduce market transparency to healthcare? Government involvement has so distorted the healthcare market that no one has any idea what products and services really cost. I think an entirely new way to provide prescription drug coverage needs to be created. Maybe MannKind needs to have their own health insurance company.
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Post by olebob1 on Nov 7, 2017 19:17:05 GMT -5
I will count that as a Strong Positive! What a Blessing!
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Post by factspls88 on Nov 7, 2017 19:17:51 GMT -5
I was disturbed by the comment by Jason about Dendreon. That, combined with the recent Cramer and Feuerstein bashings smacks of a conspiracy to destroy the stock and company. I thought we had gotten past that but I guess not. That said, I am happy about the TV campaign and increases in cartridges. As for PBMs, I would like to have heard more specifics regarding who has signed on for 2018 that were not on board in 2017 or who have improved Afrezza's accessibility with respect to classification (PA, Preferred, etc).
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Post by zuegirdor on Nov 7, 2017 19:20:34 GMT -5
Hate to rain on the parade but I cannot figure out why my cost for the titration pack was just raised TODAY from 800 to $1200. How the hell is MNKD and Afrezza gonna get people to try this at this ridiculous price, when its barely covered by insurance for most people already?Am I the first and or only person to learn of this horrific development? What is up with this 50% price raise? Is Foremost McKesson trying to kill Afrezza? Help. I cannot afford it for my son at that price! Have you asked your health insurance company why they will not provide coverage for Afrezza? Been round and round with them. He is a pediatric patient until March. Even then I suspect it will be a hard sell. tier 4 or something. I'd pay half. Would end up being the same as I paid before the most recent price rise. We have Kaiser. Knaps my hide alright....They treat us well otherwise. You gotta wonder about the MNKD strategy though. I mean I can do the price maximization algebra. That is what they use. they figure out the parabolic minimum of number of people excluded by every incremental rise in cost to arrive at the maximum sales dollars. So it makes sense on paper. But that has nothing to do with supply or demand, or the cost of manufacturing Afrezza or the value of a human life versus the price of the stock. Makes me wonder what the F$#@! I'm doing here with my measly 300 shares post reverse split.
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Post by peppy on Nov 7, 2017 19:22:59 GMT -5
I was disturbed by the comment by Jason about Dendreon. That, combined with the recent Cramer and Feuerstein bashings smacks of a conspiracy to destroy the stock and company. I thought we had gotten past that but I guess not. That said, I am happy about the TV campaign and increases in cartridges. As for PBMs, I would like to have heard more specifics regarding who has signed on for 2018 that were not on board in 2017 or who have improved Afrezza's accessibility with respect to classification (PA, Preferred, etc). as far as I could tell, "talks", no sign.
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Post by factspls88 on Nov 7, 2017 19:28:42 GMT -5
I was disturbed by the comment by Jason about Dendreon. That, combined with the recent Cramer and Feuerstein bashings smacks of a conspiracy to destroy the stock and company. I thought we had gotten past that but I guess not. That said, I am happy about the TV campaign and increases in cartridges. As for PBMs, I would like to have heard more specifics regarding who has signed on for 2018 that were not on board in 2017 or who have improved Afrezza's accessibility with respect to classification (PA, Preferred, etc). as far as I could tell, "talks", no sign. You're probably right. What happened to the big payor that was supposed to be signing on? I thought that Mike might have been keeping quiet for competitive reasons.
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Post by mango on Nov 7, 2017 19:34:36 GMT -5
Have you asked your health insurance company why they will not provide coverage for Afrezza? Been round and round with them. He is a pediatric patient until March. Even then I suspect it will be a hard sell. tier 4 or something. I'd pay half. Would end up being the same as I paid before the most recent price rise. We have Kaiser. Knaps my hide alright....They treat us well otherwise. You gotta wonder about the MNKD strategy though. I mean I can do the price maximization algebra. That is what they use. they figure out the parabolic minimum of number of people excluded by every incremental rise in cost to arrive at the maximum sales dollars. So it makes sense on paper. But that has nothing to do with supply or demand, or the cost of manufacturing Afrezza or the value of a human life versus the price of the stock. Makes me wonder what the F$#@! I'm doing here with my measly 300 shares post reverse split. I get what you are saying but MannKind isn't the one denying you prescription drug coverage, the health insurance company is. Because the health insurance company is unwilling to provide coverage, they are now influencing how your son's condition is treated. It's a shame that Endocrinologists aren't pissed and demanding something be done. I would be pissed at everyone BUT MannKind.
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Post by gamblerjag on Nov 7, 2017 19:47:00 GMT -5
Pat is an exceptional addition to our executive leadership team and he will be a huge asset for us as we transform MannKind into a world class company,” said Dr. Castagna, Chief Executive Officer of MannKind. “I expect Pat will help us to accelerate the growth of Afrezza and pipeline products to come, and position our company to deliver strong results in the years ahead.”
I'd say the plan is starting to be a world class company.. and Pat is world class speaker.
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Post by digger on Nov 7, 2017 19:51:50 GMT -5
Someone complained about an increase in price for the titration pak; I noticed on goodrx.com that the regular boxes is now $500 each. That's about par with a three pen box of humalog. Does a box of afrezza last as long as 3 humalog pens?
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Post by joeypotsandpans on Nov 7, 2017 19:54:21 GMT -5
I was disturbed by the comment by Jason about Dendreon. That, combined with the recent Cramer and Feuerstein bashings smacks of a conspiracy to destroy the stock and company. I thought we had gotten past that but I guess not. That said, I am happy about the TV campaign and increases in cartridges. As for PBMs, I would like to have heard more specifics regarding who has signed on for 2018 that were not on board in 2017 or who have improved Afrezza's accessibility with respect to classification (PA, Preferred, etc). Not sure if you caught it or maybe I was hearing things but when Mike began to respond he let out a little bit of a laugh....that individual that asked that was so far out of his league, like Mike a PharmD (who was an executive at AMGN) wouldn't know that process and prohibitive cost of the cancer treatment associated with DNDN. In their case, as Mike inferred, it is totally an apples to oranges situation and Mike tactfully educated (and it is questionable that the individual asking the question was intelligent to know the difference to begin with) in a concise response the night and day differences. Facts, the recent reawakening of the dark side only shows their desperation, otherwise they wouldn't sound a peep. They thought the game was over and got complacent and woke up about a month ago when the MM's were scrambling to keep up when the volcano gave it's warning eruption...notice the preface of warning. I'm actually encouraged with the recent spate of puppets waking up....I've been having a bit of fun with SO and his lemmings, very entertaining to say the least
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