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Post by letitride on Aug 1, 2024 5:03:17 GMT -5
Listened to the juicebox podcast with a Dr Blevins one of the investigators in the Inhale 3 study who commented that he was seeing less resistance to the pre -auths. Bodes well for Afrezza sales going forward.
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Post by sayhey24 on Aug 1, 2024 5:39:13 GMT -5
Listened to the juicebox podcast with a Dr Blevins one of the investigators in the Inhale 3 study who commented that he was seeing less resistance to the pre -auths. Bodes well for Afrezza sales going forward. Thats good news for the key accounts with limited sales but the focus needs to be to get rid of pre-auths so we can broaden outside of key accounts to other endos more important broaden to the PCP market for T2s so we can start going after that $5B in afrezza sales. Whats the link for Blevins?
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Post by agedhippie on Aug 1, 2024 7:48:35 GMT -5
...Once afrezza has insurance without pre-auths Abbott and DXCM can sell afrezza into the Medicare market so they can sell their CGMs. Why would that help? The first step in the SoC is basal insulin and that already qualifies the person for a CGM. They don't need to go the extra mile because they already have the sale. Besides, right now Dexcom and Abbott are focused on getting CGM cover for non-insulin users and are running trials to build that case.
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Post by letitride on Aug 1, 2024 8:25:09 GMT -5
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Post by sayhey24 on Aug 1, 2024 8:41:02 GMT -5
...Once afrezza has insurance without pre-auths Abbott and DXCM can sell afrezza into the Medicare market so they can sell their CGMs. Why would that help? The first step in the SoC is basal insulin and that already qualifies the person for a CGM. They don't need to go the extra mile because they already have the sale. Besides, right now Dexcom and Abbott are focused on getting CGM cover for non-insulin users and are running trials to build that case. I can't speak for Kevin Sayer but I know Robert Ford predicted his Libre would hit $4B but he was expecting icodec to get approved and he was planning on this. Afrezza without pre-auths solves his problem without fighting for CGM coverage with GLP1s. I am actually listing to the Tom Blevin's podcast right now and there was an interesting point raised about LADAs and using GLP1s and spiking after meals. Whats the T2 going to do? The GLP1s are not going to address the post meal spike and the CGM will just expose that more. Robert Ford viewed the value of the CGM with icodec and GLP1s as looking in the rear-view mirror. With afrezza his CGM has much more value. While his focus is selling CGMs if he can make a better value-proposition for his CGM, he is all in. The podcast makes the case for the afrezza/glp1 trial and Blevins said he has no afrezza studies right now. I don't know him but I will probably reach out to him as his exposure in the T2 space with afrezza seemed a bit limited.
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Post by sayhey24 on Aug 1, 2024 8:52:07 GMT -5
Thanks - It was pretty interesting. I see there is a GLP1 podcast which I have not yet listened to but I am planning on it. I don't know Tom Blevin's but I got the feeling his exposure in the T2 space using afrezza is very limited and thats the sweet spot for afrezza. He said he has no afrezza studies right now. Maybe he can suggest to Mike the afrezza/glp1 adder study. There was a short discussion of using afrezza with LADAs who are now using GLP1s and no insulin but spiking after meals. Now thats something afrezza can really help with.
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Post by porkini on Aug 1, 2024 9:46:03 GMT -5
In addition to the other comments we've seen about this podcast, I liked that Dr. Blevins is such an advocate for another insulin, especially Afrezza. At around the 1 hour mark in the podcast and the host was going to wrap up the conversation, Dr. Blevins asked if he could be allowed a bit more time and the host and he talked an additional 10 minutes about Afrezza. Great interview and worth listening to. If you don't have a full hour and 10 minutes, try bumping the speed in the settings up to 1.5X or 1.75X if you are comfortable with it being a bit sped up.
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Post by agedhippie on Aug 1, 2024 17:04:49 GMT -5
I can't speak for Kevin Sayer but I know Robert Ford predicted his Libre would hit $4B but he was expecting icodec to get approved and he was planning on this. Afrezza without pre-auths solves his problem without fighting for CGM coverage with GLP1s.... Where did Robert Ford say he was planning on Icodec getting approved to boost Libre sales? Icodec would have been a replacement for a patients's existing basal insulin, not be a net new patient so I find it hard to believe. Basal is where he see's the biggest opportunity - this line from the last earnings call talking about growth potential for Libre: "Obviously, the basal opportunity is the biggest one, and we're doing -- having great progress over there." So as you can see, no concerns on the basal market (or the failure of Iodec to get approved).
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Post by sayhey24 on Aug 1, 2024 18:09:01 GMT -5
I can't speak for Kevin Sayer but I know Robert Ford predicted his Libre would hit $4B but he was expecting icodec to get approved and he was planning on this. Afrezza without pre-auths solves his problem without fighting for CGM coverage with GLP1s.... Where did Robert Ford say he was planning on Icodec getting approved to boost Libre sales? Icodec would have been a replacement for a patients' existing basal insulin, not be a net new patient so I find it hard to believe. He can already get CGM reimbursement for T1's on Medicare since they are taking insulin. To get to the $4B they need to expand early into the T2 market. Today he has to wait until stage 4 in T2s for insulin. The sure thing was icodec as it was going to get insurance coverage out of the gate. He said he was very confident they could get the SoC changed to have icodec added to T2 treatment in an early stage before GLP1 as it would reduce A1c and be a lot cheaper than the GLP1 and only 1 shot a week. That was his plan. Now he needs a new plan. The thing is icodec with a CGM doesn't really do much except get Medicare to pay for the CGM. He said its like a rear-view mirror and the PWDs can learn from it and adjust what they eat. I would think he will have the same argument to approve CGM payment with GLP1s. The thing is most PCPs don't even have their T2 patients test their BG which is probably the case with GLP1 users. When I have asked at some educational sessions they always say they same thing - their doctor never told them to test. All they get is their 3 month A1c. Maybe if the Stelo was $5 and not $70 a lot of people will start learning about BG but not at $70. Here is what I know. The guy in San Diego was at Minimed when Al started working with Sol Steiner and now that guy better come up with a new plan to sell his CGMs as his pps took a pretty good hit in the last week. He should have bought MNKD when it was 20cents a share.
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Post by agedhippie on Aug 1, 2024 19:59:47 GMT -5
Where did Robert Ford say he was planning on Icodec getting approved to boost Libre sales? Icodec would have been a replacement for a patients' existing basal insulin, not be a net new patient so I find it hard to believe. ...He said he was very confident they could get the SoC changed to have icodec added to T2 treatment in an early stage before GLP1 as it would reduce A1c and be a lot cheaper than the GLP1 and only 1 shot a week. That was his plan. Now he needs a new plan. ... Where did he say Icodec would get the SOC changed which seems very hard to believe since it is just basal insulin (and I am still waiting for where he said Icodec would boost Libre sales)? I can understand that you think if he was you he would do this. But that's not the same as him doing this.
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Post by sayhey24 on Aug 2, 2024 6:46:01 GMT -5
...He said he was very confident they could get the SoC changed to have icodec added to T2 treatment in an early stage before GLP1 as it would reduce A1c and be a lot cheaper than the GLP1 and only 1 shot a week. That was his plan. Now he needs a new plan. ... Where did he say Icodec would get the SOC changed which seems very hard to believe since it is just basal insulin (and I am still waiting for where he said Icodec would boost Libre sales)? I can understand that you think if he was you he would do this. But that's not the same as him doing this. When Kimberly called me. He said they had all these studies ready to go to support this. IDK, these guys are playing hardball and MNKD seems to play wiffleball. Understood, MNKD resources and clout are very limited but we do have afrezza and nothing is better for showing the power of CGMs. And you are right I sure would like them to sell afrezza so they can sell their CGMs. DXCM too. To me its like peanut butter and jelly but without insurance and the SoC updates its a pipedream. However fixing the insurance and SoC are doable. What would the pps end at today if we had a 9am PR saying afrezza has Medicare coverage without pre-auths and Abbott and DXCM will now be repping it?
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Post by prcgorman2 on Aug 2, 2024 7:15:14 GMT -5
Can a CGM manufacturer “rep” an insulin?
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Post by agedhippie on Aug 2, 2024 8:10:32 GMT -5
Can a CGM manufacturer “rep” an insulin? In principle you could, and there are freelance agents who do that. The problem is that there is zero incentive for Abbott or Dexcom to play ball. They don't care how effective the insulin is, in fact CGMs are more important with more unpredictable insulins, they are selling CGMs and not a diabetes drug.
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Post by sayhey24 on Aug 2, 2024 8:47:46 GMT -5
Can a CGM manufacturer “rep” an insulin? Of course they can. If its going to help them sell their CGMs then they get the CGM sales and the afrezza commission. As I said before Kevin Sayer should have bought MNKD when it was 20cents. Afrezza is worth 10x or more than his CGMs. Right now they need the Medicare patient to be on insulin to get CGM payment. I would rather have Abbott repping afrezza in the PCP market than MNKD trying to have their own salesforce. How many times has MNKD's salesforce worked out? Look, there is nothing better to demonstrate the power of a CGM than afrezza. Inhale-3 proved that. With the CGM and afrezza the PWD can make real-time corrections. They are not looking in the rear-view mirror. They have forward looking radar with afrezza.
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Post by agedhippie on Aug 2, 2024 9:58:24 GMT -5
... Look, there is nothing better to demonstrate the power of a CGM than afrezza. Inhale-3 proved that. With the CGM and afrezza the PWD can make real-time corrections. They are not looking in the rear-view mirror. They have forward looking radar with afrezza. This is irrelevant to the CGM manufacturers. They have demonstrated the benefit of CGMs for insulin users in clinical trials to the satisfaction of the insurers and Medicare. At this point they have made the sale as anyone on insulin can have a CGM covered by insurance or Medicare. They have moved on to non-insulin users and are build their case there, so revisiting insulin has no value to them.
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