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Post by jeremg on Nov 25, 2015 22:18:27 GMT -5
To put it another way, Hakan is the guy who says "my door is always open," not someone who keeps his cards close to his vest and always plays hardball. He was just not CEO material, especially at a critical deal making time like this. You're probably right, I don't think anyone's arguing he wasn't a nice guy who meant well but that last CC with the "lets talk... call me" line ---- I'll sooner forget my fortune lost at his hands than that cringeworthy moment. I just can't forgive someone for acting so recklessly and clueless in the top executive's chair, this isn't grade school and contrary to what some may believe even corporate executives need to be held responsible for their actions when so much to so many is at stake.
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Post by mnholdem on Nov 25, 2015 22:22:10 GMT -5
Pretty strong words from a careful, well-researched poster. I know you were responsible for the nice "Thank you Hakan" thread. I was wondering if you had personal knowledge of the situation? Is there anything more you're at liberty to share? There is nothing I will share except that this isn't the first time that Hakan has agreed to become a puppet CEO. Bill Link, the founder and CEO of Chiron Vision, installed Hakan - excuse me, the "board" appointed Hakan - to the position of CEO in November 1997 for the few months preceding the acquisition of the company by Bausch & Lomb. After the buyout, B&L recognized Hakan's talent and treated him accordingly. The BofD of Bausch & Lomb immediately appointed him to the Executive Committee, named him President of their surgical division a few months later and had him heading up the North American sales & marketing region for a number of years before Alfred E. Mann hooked him to come work for him.
Sorry about getting pissed off earlier.
Oh, and perhaps "puppet CEO" (above) is a poor choice of words, even if it's accurate. Perhaps "transitional CEO" may be more fitting, IMHO.
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8-K
Nov 25, 2015 22:35:19 GMT -5
Post by stevil on Nov 25, 2015 22:35:19 GMT -5
I'll admit, I was surprised to see you get emotional about this. That's why I was wondering if you were close to the situation. You seemed to be very passionate about it.
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Post by mnholdem on Nov 25, 2015 23:03:12 GMT -5
I could be a complete stranger, but if I was driving down the street and saw a gang kicking the crap out of a man, they would regret the day they met me.
Perhaps you're familiar with something called a "mob mentality". Say a black kid gets hurt and a crowd gathers. An instigator points at a guy and says, "There he is! Get him!" The guy was walking to the store to pick up milk for the kids and next thing you know...
That's what this board was like toward Edstrom today. I wish people would do some work. Hakan is not to blame for the stock's decline, no matter who shouts "he's the guy".
I regret the "smell what you're shoveling" comment - and I apologize for it - but, frankly, these attacks on Hakan are in MY opinion, a steaming pile of BS. It's the epitome of this fallacy that shareholders today think that their rights come before everyone elses. I'm not happy with my stock position in MNKD, but I refuse to submit to the mob mentality that insists that somebody needs to be punished, whether they're at fault or not.
Many here know what is causing share price to continue to sink: extremely poor sales results from Sanofi to date.
Hakan didn't pen the deal with Sanofi. Hakan's conference performance is NOT the reason shares have dropped from nearly $11/shares in June 2014, way before he was appointed to the position of CEO.
But, I guess, it must be his fault. That is the unfortunate position of being a CEO. You catch the blame. The guy isn't even allowed to explain what's happening or he violates the terms of the L&C Agreement with Sanofi. I'm not surprised he resigned. I am surprised at how he's being treated.
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8-K
Nov 25, 2015 23:09:49 GMT -5
Post by nylefty on Nov 25, 2015 23:09:49 GMT -5
I regret the "smell what you're shoveling" comment - and I apologize for it - but, frankly, these attacks on Hakan are in MY opinion, a steaming pile of BS. You regret the insult, only to repeat it. Got it.
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Post by fedakd on Nov 25, 2015 23:22:22 GMT -5
If the CEO isn't accountable for a company's success, who is?
I'm sorry, but I refuse to accept that Hakan is in no way responsible for what we've witnessed over the last year in MNKD. Complete shareholder wealth destruction.
Again, if he was truly a "transitional" CEO, or a "puppet" as some have said, appointed for the sole purpose of watching over MNKD for the last year, we will soon have an answer. If not, the collapse in MNKD's stock chart over the last year will at least partially be attributable to him.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2015 23:31:59 GMT -5
So Hakan is still around collecting salary until July 2017 - doesn't sound like he was fired. I have read numerous comments from numerous posters that MannKind would be bankrupt before 2017. How can this be???
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8-K
Nov 25, 2015 23:41:49 GMT -5
jeremg likes this
Post by ricguy on Nov 25, 2015 23:41:49 GMT -5
I could be a complete stranger, but if I was driving down the street and saw a gang kicking the crap out of a man, they would regret the day they met me. Perhaps you're familiar with something called a "mob mentality". Say a black kid gets hurt and a crowd gathers. An instigator points at a guy and says, "There he is! Get him!" The guy was walking to the store to pick up milk for the kids and next thing you know... That's what this board was like toward Edstrom today. I wish people would do some work. Hakan is not to blame for the stock's decline, no matter who shouts "he's the guy". I regret the "smell what you're shoveling" comment - and I apologize for it - but, frankly, these attacks on Hakan are in MY opinion, a steaming pile of BS. It's the epitome of this fallacy that shareholders today think that their rights come before everyone elses. I'm not happy with my stock position in MNKD, but I refuse to submit to the mob mentality that insists that somebody needs to be punished, whether they're at fault or not. Many here know what is causing share price to continue to sink: extremely poor sales results from Sanofi to date. Hakan didn't pen the deal with Sanofi. Hakan's conference performance is NOT the reason shares have dropped from nearly $11/shares in June 2014, way before he was appointed to the position of CEO. But, I guess, it must be his fault. That is the unfortunate position of being a CEO. You catch the blame. The guy isn't even allowed to explain what's happening or he violates the terms of the L&C Agreement with Sanofi. I'm not surprised he resigned. I am surprised at how he's being treated. Granted it is not all of his fault but i'm also not going to sit here and say he has no blame in where MNKD is at today. They all have a part, good and bad. Like a coach in sports you win your the greatest thing out there, you lose you suck, not necessarily accurate but comes with the territory. I can understand why some feel sympathy and others not so much. Maybe I'm an idiot but I still don't get why he quit now after working for Al after so many years and being this close to the final goal. I guess like you said (I'm paraphrasing) things got bad there but there are always two sides to every story so I would like to hear the alternate side of Hakans (maybe when the movie comes out) and know why did they get bad. Perhaps if people had more insight into what actually went on things would be coming out different as far as their opinions and perception of Hakan but I don't see that happening and right now accurate or not Hakan is the last one people saw leaving the store when it was robbed (along the lines of your analogy). Watch as much as Al is beloved if this whole thing fails there will be some people that will be saying the same things about him. I do see (not saying I agree/disagree) where some people are coming from in lashing out at Hakan. Yes he got us through FDA and a lot of other good things and I do agree with you on the mob mentality it can get contagious and over the top, but on the flip side, emotions are high, they/we all have a lot of money at stake, no-one knows what exactly happened other than what they see which is a CEO who for whatever reason his fault or not has/had no TS deals, bad CC calls which doesn't project investor confidence, had to be told to stop selling shares, was just appointed about a year ago, and then suddenly quits(?) all while collecting millions for the next couple of years while the peon investors are hoping this gets turned around.
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Post by lakers on Nov 25, 2015 23:59:29 GMT -5
At this juncture, Mnkd needs a CEO with different skill sets, especially negotiation skill, and authority. Al has that. It may be early to judge whether Afrezza deal is a raw deal or not as CTO obfuscated many details. One mysterious milestone has no title, type, $$$. The Buy In/Out detail was redacted. Interestingly, CTO expires 11/10/2017, 4.5 mos after Hakan's service ending 7/1/17 indicating an air tight gag order for something extraordinarily important such as a mysterious joint dev, or Buy In/Out based on certain milestones, CRVs.
Mnkd BoD must have consulted Sanofi before deciding to retain Hanka's service that extraordinarily long. This indicated Sanofi and Mnkd can't afford to leak CTO.
IMHO, Hakan made a poor judgment by committing to a deal before EOY. He might have been scorned by Matt. Hakan then quickly added "or 1Q16". In negotiations, when you need it more than the potential partners, do not announce a deadline to the public b/c it undermines your leverage as they know mgmt would be subject to SH law suit if that won't materialize. Al had no choice but took over.
Back in May, Matt seemed so cavalier saying that Mnkd might have enough cast to pay off $100M Notes. Moreover, mgmt didn't have a sense of urgency about the cash balance or how to fund TS pipeline. Mgmt must have thought deals were imminent.
Ironically, to avoid another SH law suit, Al has to close deals in the timeline dictated by his subordinate. As a deal making veteran, Al felt boxed in. He had to take over to prevent future mishaps.
Al is not entirely irreprehensible as he knows Hakan and Matt better than anyone else. Hakan is a decent COO but the CEO job was beyond his league. I didn't feel Hakan qualified. Al rewarded loyalty for the CEO job. He must have been overconfident that Afrezza would be launched smoothly out of the gate. Afrezza is Al's first drug gig. He underestimated what it took and BP's, shorts' resolve to kill Afrezza.
Al put all eggs in one basket. He should have pumped more money into Mnkd to dev TS pipeline concurrently instead of suspending them and laying off developers. He should know drug dev is very time consuming.
Afrezza superior study should have been started last year right after the Sny deal.
Many asked why mgmt didn't raise fund when pps was in double digits. The simple answer was everyone thought Afrezza would be a BB out of the gate. Apparently, they repeat the same mistake as another drug. The pre-launch mkt research mgmt conducted about Afrezza was faulty. You can't say you didn't anticipate the spirometer, mkt access, pricing, conservative MDs considering that Sny has launched many drugs and knew about the other drug debacle.
To be fair it's 90% Al's, 10% Hakan's culpability. Al was the one who recruited, groomed, and promoted Hakan. He must know Hakan's limitation. I chalk it up as Al's lesson learned as he was an amateur in drug biz.
Al has had more experience in device than drug biz. Ditto his deal making expertise.
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Post by trenddiver on Nov 26, 2015 2:05:20 GMT -5
So Hakan is still around collecting salary until July 2017 - doesn't sound like he was fired. I have read numerous comments from numerous posters that MannKind would be bankrupt before 2017. How can this be??? Sorry. One of the dumbest posts ever on this board.
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8-K
Nov 26, 2015 2:39:45 GMT -5
Post by waldemar on Nov 26, 2015 2:39:45 GMT -5
The arrangement aims at hard-blocking him from joining a competitor as he knew so much about TS pipeline dev and negotiation, and Afrezza CTO which expires before 7/1/17. BoD likely conferred w/ Sanofi who requested that strange arrangement. "Mr. Edstrom would provide the Company with a general release of claims and remain employed with the Company to provide transition and other services through July 1, 2017, subject to his earlier resignation or termination by the Company" Lakers, even if your explanation is the actual truth, I still do not see the logic why this should be announced 1.5 years earlier.
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Post by afrizzle on Nov 26, 2015 6:16:08 GMT -5
I'm the camp that believes Haken wasn't suited for the CEO role but brought other values to the company. His demotion could be as simple as Haken and the board both understanding and acting on this. I also don't believe he had to remain employed to protect confidentiality. The standard MannKind NDA is professionally strict anyway, I can only imagine the C level agreement to be no less so. It's cost effective and to mutual benefit to retain his skill, at a level and scope where he's of value to the company. This way there is no law suit or contention, and the parachute payments he'd otherwise get are paid in return for continued effort. We'll never know unless they tell us though
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8-K
Nov 26, 2015 7:16:12 GMT -5
via mobile
fedakd likes this
Post by bloodrootfc on Nov 26, 2015 7:16:12 GMT -5
1) Statistically speaking, Al Mann is not likely to live three more days much less three more years. This is the end of the line for him.
2) Hakan departure and CTO options are related.
3) Hakan was just a placeholder as CEO.
4) Company was not terribly concerned with cash reserves.
1+2+3+4 = $10B buyout.
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8-K
Nov 26, 2015 7:20:38 GMT -5
Post by hammer on Nov 26, 2015 7:20:38 GMT -5
After reading the 8k two potential scenarios came to mind I will throw out.
First, Due to health reasons Hakan could no longer continue with full time duties of CEO at a time in which a CEO attention is needed 110%. 8K does not supersede the HIPPA requirement for his privacy.
Second, Hakan is staying to be announced as CEO of Mannkind Technologies to continue Technosphere development if Afrezza is sold after a spin off. Otherwise a non-compete and disclosure agreement would have been signed and a check would have been written.
Have a wonderful Thanksgiving!
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8-K
Nov 26, 2015 7:24:24 GMT -5
Post by peppy on Nov 26, 2015 7:24:24 GMT -5
At this juncture, Mnkd needs a CEO with different skill sets, especially negotiation skill, and authority. Al has that. It may be early to judge whether Afrezza deal is a raw deal or not as CTO obfuscated many details. One mysterious milestone has no title, type, $$$. The Buy In/Out detail was redacted. Interestingly, CTO expires 11/10/2017, 4.5 mos after Hakan's service ending 7/1/17 indicating an air tight gag order for something extraordinarily important such as a mysterious joint dev, or Buy In/Out based on certain milestones, CRVs.
Mnkd BoD must have consulted Sanofi before deciding to retain Hanka's service that extraordinarily long. This indicated Sanofi and Mnkd can't afford to leak CTO. IMHO, Hakan made a poor judgment by committing to a deal before EOY. He might have been scorned by Matt. Hakan then quickly added "or 1Q16". In negotiations, when you need it more than the potential partners, do not announce a deadline to the public b/c it undermines your leverage as they know mgmt would be subject to SH law suit if that won't materialize. Al had no choice but took over. Back in May, Matt seemed so cavalier saying that Mnkd might have enough cast to pay off $100M Notes. Moreover, mgmt didn't have a sense of urgency about the cash balance or how to fund TS pipeline. Mgmt must have thought deals were imminent. Ironically, to avoid another SH law suit, Al has to close deals in the timeline dictated by his subordinate. As a deal making veteran, Al felt boxed in. He had to take over to prevent future mishaps. Al is not entirely irreprehensible as he knows Hakan and Matt better than anyone else. Hakan is a decent COO but the CEO job was beyond his league. I didn't feel Hakan qualified. Al rewarded loyalty for the CEO job. He must have been overconfident that Afrezza would be launched smoothly out of the gate. Afrezza is Al's first drug gig. He underestimated what it took and BP's, shorts' resolve to kill Afrezza. Al put all eggs in one basket. He should have pumped more money into Mnkd to dev TS pipeline concurrently instead of suspending them and laying off developers. He should know drug dev is very time consuming. Afrezza superior study should have been started last year right after the Sny deal. Many asked why mgmt didn't raise fund when pps was in double digits. The simple answer was everyone thought Afrezza would be a BB out of the gate. Apparently, they repeat the same mistake as another drug. The pre-launch mkt research mgmt conducted about Afrezza was faulty. You can't say you didn't anticipate the spirometer, mkt access, pricing, conservative MDs considering that Sny has launched many drugs and knew about the other drug debacle. To be fair it's 90% Al's, 10% Hakan's culpability. Al was the one who recruited, groomed, and promoted Hakan. He must know Hakan's limitation. I chalk it up as Al's lesson learned as he was an amateur in drug biz. Al has had more experience in device than drug biz. Ditto his deal making expertise. Something Al is needed for. What does he hold 40% of Mannkind?
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