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Post by joeypotsandpans on Jan 6, 2016 9:36:19 GMT -5
MnHoldem's Support Plan for U.S. Commercialization of Afrezza:
1. Lower the price to below current RAA insulin (Novolog, Humulog);
2. Prove superiority via FDA-approved postmarket trial ASAP; 2a. Fund university studies to confirm previous studies demonstrating 40% effectiveness of early insulin treatment for remission of disease;
3. Raise price of Afrezza based on superiority data.
#1 may lead to better Tier coverage
#2 definitely will lead to better Tier coverage
#3 by then, market penetration and demand for Afrezza will prevail... just don't raise the price too much! Hell MN, I would shoot for Tier 1...I dont believe it has to be generic to be Tier 1 rather just least expensive in its class and for now that's RAA's. Now that would be fun to watch play out...wouldn't it  |
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Post by curiousdoc on Jan 6, 2016 9:37:53 GMT -5
MnHoldem's Support Plan for U.S. Commercialization of Afrezza:
1. Lower the price to below current RAA insulin (Novolog, Humulog);
2. Prove superiority via FDA-approved postmarket trial ASAP; 2a. Fund university studies to confirm previous studies demonstrating 40% effectiveness of early insulin treatment for remission of disease;
3. Raise price of Afrezza based on superiority data.
#1 may lead to better Tier coverage
#2 definitely will lead to better Tier coverage
#3 by then, market penetration and demand for Afrezza will prevail... just don't raise the price too much! This sounds great.
How do they finance ANY of it?
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Post by hawaiiguy42 on Jan 6, 2016 9:40:35 GMT -5
Off the wall question... since the Sanofi and MNKD deal is over, does this mean insiders can start buying?
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Post by kc on Jan 6, 2016 9:44:06 GMT -5
At what reasonable price point do you think the insurance cos. would have to instantly move to Tier 2 without hesitation? Novo did it with Levemir and Novolog to gain essentially "monopolistic" contracts with certain providers, MNKD should now use their same tactics with the superior product (save the label comments) and beat them at their own game... It's all about the $$$ to the insurance whores. I would think it's time for the scorned Mann's gloves to come off and make it not feasible for the insurance cos. to keep Afrezza off Tier 2 status anymore. Time to take this battle to the bottom line and set the price war in motion...let's see how fast that gets a resolution to this BP game that's been played. They tried the conventional approach via an inept SNY, time to go non traditional and create the push that's been waiting. Create the flood to break the gates open and get those 3 lines cranking. Better product, lower price = instant created demand and ultimate success. Yes it can be that easy if you have the better product and the wherewithal to set a price they can't refuse. Next week's conference is an opportunity to come out swinging, Matt alluded in the call yesterday that pricing is an option, I liked his last statement... "We view this as an opportunity NOT an obstacle" ....in the end Brandicourt and his so called bs dtc magazine strategy will go by the way of Napoleon and show him as the idiot he truly is for letting this holy grail that he had in his grasp get away IMO. It's a new day carpe diem I posted this 2014 article yesterday on another thread.
INSULIN STICKER SHOCK.
insulinnation.com/treatment2/medicine-drugs/understanding-insulin-sticker-shock/
Seems that big Pharma really has a monopoly on product and pricing. It would be great to underprice them and deliver a better product. We go screwed by Sanofi. They knew that the could kill Afrezza by over pricing the product in the market. MannKind needs to find a way to get back into the market with a good company and a distribution network and sell it as cheaply as the can. perhaps even pricing if the can close to generic pens. Put the pressure on the big boys. I hope they figure how to get engaged with a company that understands that market. Like Teva or Perigo. There are others in that space. Mannkind can't go it alone. They have to be part of something bigger to survive at this point. The Company needs to be sold. Sadly if it does not get sold than we all lose our investment. So hopefully smarter people are working hard to get a Teva interested. It would be great to have a named brand product Afrezza priced close to what a Generic pen sells for to the consumer. It won't happen unless they take the lumps and make a deal with somebody quickly.
I hope we have a plan and the can move it forward. I know we produce the product but do we also package it? It seemed to me that we shipped it off to get finished? Does anybody know that answer?
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Post by pengiep on Jan 6, 2016 9:48:29 GMT -5
Who cares about proving something to SNY? They always intended to kill MNKD and the sooner we act with that realization, the better. Undercutting and destroying their prandial insulin products and profiting from doing so would be a really nice "in-your-face" and an appropriate response for the hose-job SNY gave MNKD.
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Post by joeypotsandpans on Jan 6, 2016 10:16:14 GMT -5
At what reasonable price point do you think the insurance cos. would have to instantly move to Tier 2 without hesitation? Novo did it with Levemir and Novolog to gain essentially "monopolistic" contracts with certain providers, MNKD should now use their same tactics with the superior product (save the label comments) and beat them at their own game... It's all about the $$$ to the insurance whores. I would think it's time for the scorned Mann's gloves to come off and make it not feasible for the insurance cos. to keep Afrezza off Tier 2 status anymore. Time to take this battle to the bottom line and set the price war in motion...let's see how fast that gets a resolution to this BP game that's been played. They tried the conventional approach via an inept SNY, time to go non traditional and create the push that's been waiting. Create the flood to break the gates open and get those 3 lines cranking. Better product, lower price = instant created demand and ultimate success. Yes it can be that easy if you have the better product and the wherewithal to set a price they can't refuse. Next week's conference is an opportunity to come out swinging, Matt alluded in the call yesterday that pricing is an option, I liked his last statement... "We view this as an opportunity NOT an obstacle" ....in the end Brandicourt and his so called bs dtc magazine strategy will go by the way of Napoleon and show him as the idiot he truly is for letting this holy grail that he had in his grasp get away IMO. It's a new day carpe diem I posted this 2014 article yesterday on another thread.
INSULIN STICKER SHOCK.
insulinnation.com/treatment2/medicine-drugs/understanding-insulin-sticker-shock/
Seems that big Pharma really has a monopoly on product and pricing. It would be great to underprice them and deliver a better product. We go screwed by Sanofi. They knew that the could kill Afrezza by over pricing the product in the market. MannKind needs to find a way to get back into the market with a good company and a distribution network and sell it as cheaply as the can. perhaps even pricing if the can close to generic pens. Put the pressure on the big boys. I hope they figure how to get engaged with a company that understands that market. Like Teva or Perigo. There are others in that space.
I hope we have a play and the can move it forward. I know we produce the product but do we also package it? It seemed to me that we shipped it off to get finished? Does anybody know that answer?
KC, I'm sure we'll find out a lot of those answers coming out in the next weeks, months...starting with next weeks opportunity to hit the road running. Matt knows where their economic tolerance price points are so what's truly feasible and strategically plausible I'm sure will be discussed among mgmt. soon enough and most already likely has. My point of the thread is that this company is still a viable game changer and a fighter...Matt's words or something to the effect (and I'm paraphrasing) it's not the first time we've faced perceived adversity and we've overcome them each time. Do we have the better mousetrap? Absolutely IMO as well as and more importantly current users opinions. Reminds me of a case study I did back in school...an upstart airline with a new approach and pricing model to current standards. The new entrant came in and was so cost effective with a different approach in customer service. The existing carrier tried to drop their price to compete and eventually failed due to their cost structure. The new carrier continued to flourish and is one of the most loyal employee vested success stories still today. The new carrier at the time was Southwest, the existing was Braniff, the market I believe (from recollection) was Dallas - Houston. Southwest was a very disruptive "little engine that could" that didn't care about travel agencies, assigned seating, joking with passengers and making travel fun, union labor, etc etc and look where they are now. Different industries but same philosophy... take care of the customer (patient) and the rest should take care of itself...sound familiar, unfortunately SNY never really marketed to the masses the way they should have in creating proper patient awareness. |
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Post by dudley on Jan 6, 2016 10:35:27 GMT -5
Can MNKD produce, market, and sell the product profitably with a 20% price cut? Does anybody know the all-inclusive cost of sales per unit versus was a 20% discount to managed care pricing would look like? Afrezza is not as efficient as injected insulin due to the amount of drug not absorbed via the lung, so there is more active pharmaceutical ingredient required to deliver an equivalent therapeutic dose, plus the additional cost of the device and delivery system. What are the real economics of that "wake up call"? We've known for ages now that MNKD has the Pfizer insulin in storage and it is supposedly still good and best of all completely paid for. There is supposed to be enough to sell $10 Billion worth of product. It needs to be FDA certified but per earlier comments from Matt that is not an expensive or lengthy process. With free insulin that should dramatically lower the cost to produce - I can't imagine the cartridges and packaging are all that expensive. They could most certainly sell Afrezza a lot more cheaply. As far as that goes, they could produce their own "webmercials" by anyone talented and end up with something a hell of a lot more clever than the moronic "same old same old, I'll ask my doctor blah blah" crap SNY would inevitably be doing. AS far as THAT goes, what stops them from opening up a web store with in-house pharmacist and doctor who can prescribe on the spot ? Call in, consult the doc, get the script and the package goes out in the mail. Seems there are a lot of options that open up now the yoke is off. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2016 10:39:38 GMT -5
MnHoldem's Support Plan for U.S. Commercialization of Afrezza:
1. Lower the price to below current RAA insulin (Novolog, Humulog);
2. Prove superiority via FDA-approved postmarket trial ASAP; 2a. Fund university studies to confirm previous studies demonstrating 40% effectiveness of early insulin treatment for remission of disease;
3. Raise price of Afrezza based on superiority data.
#1 may lead to better Tier coverage
#2 definitely will lead to better Tier coverage
#3 by then, market penetration and demand for Afrezza will prevail... just don't raise the price too much! Wheres the money coming from for this? |
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Post by suebeeee1 on Jan 6, 2016 10:40:07 GMT -5
I hope we have a plan and the can move it forward. I know we produce the product but do we also package it? It seemed to me that we shipped it off to get finished? Does anybody know that answer?
I hope someone at MNKD has been working on packaging possibilities now for months and are ready to start putting the newly manufactured Afrezza into those boxes today. |
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Post by suebeeee1 on Jan 6, 2016 10:41:30 GMT -5
Can MNKD produce, market, and sell the product profitably with a 20% price cut? Does anybody know the all-inclusive cost of sales per unit versus was a 20% discount to managed care pricing would look like? Afrezza is not as efficient as injected insulin due to the amount of drug not absorbed via the lung, so there is more active pharmaceutical ingredient required to deliver an equivalent therapeutic dose, plus the additional cost of the device and delivery system. What are the real economics of that "wake up call"? As far as that goes, they could produce their own "webmercials" by anyone talented and end up with something a hell of a lot more clever than the moronic "same old same old, I'll ask my doctor blah blah" crap SNY would inevitably be doing. AS far as THAT goes, what stops them from opening up a web store with in-house pharmacist and doctor who can prescribe on the spot ? Call in, consult the doc, get the script and the package goes out in the mail. Seems there are a lot of options that open up now the yoke is off. LOL....there is already a commercial ready to go. Just ask Compound for it! |
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Post by kc on Jan 6, 2016 10:52:25 GMT -5
MnHoldem's Support Plan for U.S. Commercialization of Afrezza:
1. Lower the price to below current RAA insulin (Novolog, Humulog);
2. Prove superiority via FDA-approved postmarket trial ASAP; 2a. Fund university studies to confirm previous studies demonstrating 40% effectiveness of early insulin treatment for remission of disease;
3. Raise price of Afrezza based on superiority data.
#1 may lead to better Tier coverage
#2 definitely will lead to better Tier coverage
#3 by then, market penetration and demand for Afrezza will prevail... just don't raise the price too much! Wheres the money coming from for this? The money will have to come from who ever buys the company. They don't have the money to finance this unless they get the product on the market and selling. |
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Post by peppy on Jan 6, 2016 10:52:37 GMT -5
Can MNKD produce, market, and sell the product profitably with a 20% price cut? Does anybody know the all-inclusive cost of sales per unit versus was a 20% discount to managed care pricing would look like? Afrezza is not as efficient as injected insulin due to the amount of drug not absorbed via the lung, so there is more active pharmaceutical ingredient required to deliver an equivalent therapeutic dose, plus the additional cost of the device and delivery system. What are the real economics of that "wake up call"? We've known for ages now that MNKD has the Pfizer insulin in storage and it is supposedly still good and best of all completely paid for. There is supposed to be enough to sell $10 Billion worth of product. It needs to be FDA certified but per earlier comments from Matt that is not an expensive or lengthy process. With free insulin that should dramatically lower the cost to produce - I can't imagine the cartridges and packaging are all that expensive. They could most certainly sell Afrezza a lot more cheaply. As far as that goes, they could produce their own "webmercials" by anyone talented and end up with something a hell of a lot more clever than the moronic "same old same old, I'll ask my doctor blah blah" crap SNY would inevitably be doing. AS far as THAT goes, what stops them from opening up a web store with in-house pharmacist and doctor who can prescribe on the spot ? Call in, consult the doc, get the script and the package goes out in the mail. Seems there are a lot of options that open up now the yoke is off. regarding webmercials, he does understand afrezza: Matt down under: Matt Bendall
@mattybendall
Segment producer for @theprojecttv, afrezzadownunder.com/
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Post by inittowinit on Jan 6, 2016 11:04:46 GMT -5
MNKD must get competitive with their pricing. As a business owner, I have always believed that your competition sets your rates.
This seems expecially true with a medication that will require a lifetime commitment.
As for further impediment from BP, I expect they are far from done trying to kill beautiful Afrezza. It's David vs Goliath IMO, we must keep our resolve strong and IMO MNKD must get aggressive and take this fight to all who would hinder the success of giving Afrezza the chance to improve the quality of life for PWD.
As a side note, I have sold my SNY shares. I will keep it christian and hold my tongue on my personal thoughts about these skulleys.
For me, depending on what I hear and see from MNKD moving forward, I am prepared and willing to put my money where my mouth is if I see a clear and aggressive game plan from management. I wonder are there others who would do the same?
P.S. I have never experienced anything like this in my life regarding bringing a life changing product to market. I privately wonder just how involved BP is in the killing of Afrezza.
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Post by sccrbrg on Jan 6, 2016 11:12:20 GMT -5
Can MNKD produce, market, and sell the product profitably with a 20% price cut? Does anybody know the all-inclusive cost of sales per unit versus was a 20% discount to managed care pricing would look like? Afrezza is not as efficient as injected insulin due to the amount of drug not absorbed via the lung, so there is more active pharmaceutical ingredient required to deliver an equivalent therapeutic dose, plus the additional cost of the device and delivery system. What are the real economics of that "wake up call"? In this entire thread, no one has mentioned profit margins until this... I would imagine it costs more to produce afrezza than your typical insulin, so I'm not sure they could afford to turn afrezza into a loss leader just for the sake of market share. In fact, if they lose money on each unit sold, larger market share would only exacerbate their financial woes. It's going to depend entirely on what their margins are, and I don't think they've ever stated those on record. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2016 11:17:07 GMT -5
Can MNKD produce, market, and sell the product profitably with a 20% price cut? Does anybody know the all-inclusive cost of sales per unit versus was a 20% discount to managed care pricing would look like? Afrezza is not as efficient as injected insulin due to the amount of drug not absorbed via the lung, so there is more active pharmaceutical ingredient required to deliver an equivalent therapeutic dose, plus the additional cost of the device and delivery system. What are the real economics of that "wake up call"? In this entire thread, no one has mentioned profit margins until this... I would imagine it costs more to produce afrezza than your typical insulin, so I'm not sure they could afford to turn afrezza into a loss leader just for the sake of market share. In fact, if they lose money on each unit sold, larger market share would only exacerbate their financial woes. It's going to depend entirely on what their margins are, and I don't think they've ever stated those on record. at this point, margins should be good. ( product costs ). there were lots of calculations in 2014 but in general what do u think they will be more? marketing / trial costs / personnel are usually the highest %age |
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