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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 16:14:46 GMT -5
Lots of theories floated all year long about whether SNY was sandbagging mnkd or not. My thought is that the previous ceo of sny had a vision, brandicourt had a different vision (whether forced on him by the sny board or not). Regardless, imo the problem started with the few quotes we had from sny (fall 2014) about what their survey's told them (first key point btw) and sny's belief that they could price afrezza higher than existing treatments due to the lack of needles. Then came december 10 2014 (or thereabouts) and mnkd got the sec to apply a CTO to parts of the contract. The part that was black lined included numbers around the sales price of afrezza. This will be key to understanding (or not) the issues. I believe it's possible if not likely that the deal between the two created a product where they couldn't lower the price due to the costs and profit sharing involved. This herein would be the problem with a lawsuit against sny in combination with their "surveys". I'm guessing sny can prove they couldn't lower the sales price of afrezza as the contract, costs, and expected/desired profits were structured. As a result, afrezza couldn't compete cost wise with existing therapies. AS a result, insurance companies refused to cover it in tier 2 thus squashing sales. Well, you see where I'm going with this so I won't belabor the point. But if any of this turns out to be true, no judge will favor on mnkd's side. It might have been that brandicort looked at afrezza and the contract and decided "if the drug sells, great, if not we will dump it". Thoughts? I dont think so although a lot will have to do with how things go in the transition. Dont forget, MNKD had a seat at the table and had an equal vote. I believe MNKD went along with whatever Sanofi proposed because MNKD believed that Sanofi knew what they were doing with the launch. Very little basis for a lawsuit. Trend The only way Mannkind would have a case is if they can prove what Sanofi said they would do wasn't what they actually did. And that would be difficult to prove unless Mannkind can procure a whistle blower within Sanofi. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 16:04:17 GMT -5
Not seeing a link on the company's website to access. Any thoughts??? I am sure Mannkind will post it AFTER the CC is over with in typical management fashion! LOL. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 16:01:51 GMT -5
A 1 year test drive for 200M....... Al better stick it to SNY! More like taking the test drive to the demolition derby. That's not what the money was for. Just hope Al did not rely on SNY's good intentions. Maybe Al can sue SNY for elder abuse!  |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 15:50:22 GMT -5
As others have said, no rose colored glasses today. This hurts. Bad. Now if I were Al Mann, I would be seething angry. Sanofi sandbagged him and Mannkind shareholders. Plain and simple. So I have a new dream. First, we survive. I think we will with Al Mann's help. Time to sue Sanofi for not living up to their end of the deal. Second, if we survive, then there is a new mission. A new dream. A new hope. TAKE MARKET SHARE FROM SANOFI! I hope we stick it to them but good over the years. I hope Mannkind becomes an ever present nightmare for Sanofi. I have a dream....  What do you sue Sanofi for? Breach of contract? Good luck in proving that. But let's say Mannkind does. How much money, time and effort will it take? Mannkind doesn't have a lot of resources or money for that. Sanofi can drag this out as long as they need to until Mannkind declares bankruptcy. Many of you are so emotional over the news today that you no longer are thinking rationally. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 13:03:54 GMT -5
From the agreement...(thanks petech on a different folder) If, at any time on or after January 1, 2016, Sanofi determines in good faith that Commercialization of Product is no longer economically viable in the United States, then Sanofi may terminate this Agreement in its entirety upon delivery of at least ninety (90) days’ prior written notice to MannKind. Read more: mnkd.proboards.com/thread/4693/agreements#ixzz3wOT7gbc3ok so that might mean SNY isn't totally out of the picture but won't be marketing it in the US of A. Nevermind, just read the details and if I understand it correctly, the entire partnership is being dissolved and SNY will not market this in any other country.  |
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Lakers
Jan 5, 2016 12:48:54 GMT -5
Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 12:48:54 GMT -5
what this should prove to everyone that anonymous message board posters who make claims should never be trusted. I have never come across one yet who actually knew what they were talking about. This could have been viewed both ways - IMO - however, no one knows what is going on internally. Lakers made his best calls based on the info at hand. And it could have gone either way. Once again IMO. I remain optimistic and view MNKD separating from SNY as a positive - though not in the short term. We'll know much, much more after the call today. "This could have been viewed both ways?" With all due respect but you really are divorced from reality if you are unable to see just how wrong Lakers post was. |
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Lakers
Jan 5, 2016 12:39:50 GMT -5
Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 12:39:50 GMT -5
Lakers come back to me, I need you and I love you! Lakers what the hell is going on?  My tribute to Afro man & his hit song "Palmdale" I think he and many others have discredited themselves with their false information. |
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Lakers
Jan 5, 2016 12:30:45 GMT -5
Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 12:30:45 GMT -5
On 12/21, lakers wrote: "1. Sanofi partnership remains STRONG, going full tilt in 1Q16. I unequivocally believe the death of the partnership has been greatly exaggerated. You can stop doubting it now. For non-believers, you can write off for tax now if it makes you sleep better. But if you are still in, absolutely don't lose sleep over it." what this should prove to everyone that anonymous message board posters who make claims should never be trusted. I have never come across one yet who actually knew what they were talking about. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 12:10:53 GMT -5
I hope Al & team were working behind the scenes the last couple of weeks formulating their plan of attack. However, if SNY was bleeding them for a cheap deal I sure hope Al sells cheap to a SNY competitor! F$#% SNY...... At this point, investors better hope Al and Duane can pull something of significance from out of their behinds because the ship is taking on water fast. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 11:57:02 GMT -5
Is his ability to purchase eight million shares based on today's closing price? Or some other date? What ever date it is, his purchase price is going to be cheap cheap cheap. But then again, he knew he would get a discount on the pps as he knew this news was going to coincide with his start date. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 11:34:55 GMT -5
I am wondering if today's news is known by MNKD before or after MNKD new CEO took the offer? The scary word in my mind now is BK. MNKD knew the fate of the partnership when it removed HAKAN as CEO. That's obvious. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 11:22:46 GMT -5
The one thing I was just reminded of and what SANOFI will not discuss is that those T1s using Afrezza found they needed LESS BASAL insulin. And BASAL insulin is Sanofi's bread and butter. That tells you just how well Afrezza works but SNY saw that if Afrezza gained traction, their golden basal goose was going to get cooked. And that's the brand new road block Mannkind needs to get over.
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 11:16:34 GMT -5
Why did Sanofi walk away? Insurance reluctance to cover it and poor label that would have been very expensive to correct it. Agree here and my next question is why did SNY partner in the first place? SNY is experienced they must have known at least some of these obstacles, wonder how this would have played out with SNY's previous CEO. The quote from the SNY spokeshack doesn't make sense unless the company defines best efforts by SNY as doing the bare minimum. Many doctors never heard of Afrezza. I think the problems surrounding SNY's diabetes division are so great that the company had to make a decision as to what they wanted to focus on and Afrezza wasn't one of them due to the costs associated and the fact that it didn't own it 100%. We can speculate that if Afrezza was 100% owned by SNY, would it have dropped it? I don't think so. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 11:04:31 GMT -5
I disagree. As yourself why? Why was there no market? Was it because the product is ineffective? NO. Was it because patients didn't like it? NO. There was no market because SNY did a piss-poor job of educating doctors on it's efficacy, how to use it appropriately and did jack-squat to improve formulary coverage, likely all by design. Afrezza didn't sell because they didn't WANT it to sell. Plain and simple. You can look at this as a negative, but with SNY as our partner, the stock lost 85% of it's value. They tried to kill MNKD. When they realized they couldn't and wouldn't be able to steal Afrezza for cheap, they bailed. Al likely called their bluff and this was probably planned months ago, which is why today is coincidentally the new CEO's FIRST DAY. Read the tea leaves. [ Ok, I can see all of what you're saying.... But in the end, if Afrezza is so good (which I believe) and no one knows it more than SNY, why would SNY walk away from it? If the drug is so incredible it won't be buried, so why abandon it for someone else? Why did Sanofi walk away? Insurance reluctance to cover it and poor label that would have been very expensive to correct it. |
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Post by mindovermatter on Jan 5, 2016 10:35:01 GMT -5
How in the world would MNKD pay for the long term safety study??? and what happens to the pediatric study? Does it get halted and dissolved? |
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