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Post by sweedee79 on Mar 16, 2021 10:19:30 GMT -5
This is fantastic news. If I'm understanding the info correctly from the CMS link provided, each of the insulins listed from all 5 participating pharmaceutical manufacturers will have the same $35 co-pay. In other words, Afrezza will have price parity with the other insulins on the co-pays for the 3.3 million Part D Medicare seniors starting January 2022. The only downside for Mannkind that I see is that there may be no profit on these sales. But at least it puts Afrezza into the hands of many diabetics who have been locked out of it due to price, which should be worth it to gain market share. + it creates provider prescribing habit (hopefully). We still have the problem of docs not knowing how to dose ... Etc. But hopefully Vdex picks up the ball and runs with it.. |
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Post by morfu on Mar 16, 2021 10:42:18 GMT -5
+ it creates provider prescribing habit (hopefully). We still have the problem of docs not knowing how to dose ... Etc. But hopefully Vdex picks up the ball and runs with it.. I claim that regular doctors are getting better at this and any patient can get all relevant information online for example by joining Sam finta´s FB group.
I do not share these hopes for Vdex being at all relevant for Afrezza.
Their absence of numbers speaks loudly, last week they finally presented a white paper proving that Afrezza is working, they seem more than 5 years behind with that with their 4 or 5 clinics! There are more than 200 000 practicing doctors in the USA of which about 6000 are Endos which about 800 of them being pediatric Endos. Please keep in mind that a claim like "we must trust Vdex, because the other doctors do not get it!" is nothing but baseless. I think Vdex people here made similar claims long enough, they should put up some proof!
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Post by sportsrancho on Mar 16, 2021 11:02:07 GMT -5
Five years behind? That was the fourth White Paper. If you want individual care that last longer than 15 minutes every 3-6 months, you can come to us and be monitored weekly. We will get your A1 C down and handle the insurance for you. You will learn how to use a CGM and learn how to dose ( which is key ) with our protocols. We are with you every step of the way. We believe your results will speak for themselves. www.vdexdiabetes.com/whitepapers |
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Post by morfu on Mar 16, 2021 11:28:42 GMT -5
Five years behind? That was the fourth White Paper. If you want individual care that last longer than 15 minutes every 3-6 months, you can come to us and be monitored weekly. We will get your A1 C down and handle the insurance for you. You will learn how to use a CGM and learn how to dose ( which is key ) with our protocols. We are with you every step of the way. We believe your results will speak for themselves. www.vdexdiabetes.com/whitepapers>> Five years behind?
Yes at least 5years, Afrezza worked just as well with non-Vdex patients years ago, so these papers just show how Vdex is trailing behind.
The implied claim here that patients need Vdex to "handle the insurance for you. You will learn how to use a CGM and learn how to dose" needs to be proven!
You are just loudly repeating an old story!
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Post by sportsrancho on Mar 16, 2021 11:37:44 GMT -5
And I’m going to keep repeating it because it works😎👍🏻
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Post by morfu on Mar 16, 2021 12:18:58 GMT -5
And I’m going to keep repeating it because it works😎👍🏻
pguerrero made a lot of claims (which I would love to discuss more, but for some reason his/her thread is locked.. maybe because it degraded into ad hominem attacks) One was: "top 10 volume endos in the country’s (all being paid to prescribe Afrezza through meaningless talks that know one attend) scripts out of the equation there would be 300 Trx a week"
These numbers seem believable to me and I also think they getting continuously better at "get your A1 C down and handle the insurance for you. You will learn how to use a CGM and learn how to dose" which could be a reason for the seemingly improving retention rate. So Mannkind might be better of working with them and the top 100 or top 1000.. oh isn't that what Mannkind has been doing for years?
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Post by sweedee79 on Mar 16, 2021 13:14:10 GMT -5
The company took Afrezza to market before superiority studies were done.. before accurate label was obtained.. also the SOC doesn't support what Afrezza can do....
We weren't able to educate docs on how to properly use Afrezza because there were so many things the label didn't allow us to say.. and it almost appeared that the company itself didn't understand Afrezza..
Docs are afraid of tighter control and seem to think an A1C of 7 is ok. Also didn't want the trouble of having to do spiro or learn something new unless they have to.. they are already so busy..
Insurance didn't want to cover a more expensive alternative if they didn't have to.. We are up against the status quo without a leg to stand on..
As was claimed it had nothing to do with Afrezza users not liking it.. that's just not true.. How would they even know if Afrezza was good when they didn't know how to use it in the first place.. or didn't know much about it and didn't have the support in the change..
I don't understand why you or anyone else would be so against Vdex. It appears to me they are growing.. and with telemedicine they can reach many more people.. it's just a waste of time to run down someone who is on our side no matter what the case is or turns out to be.
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Post by morfu on Mar 16, 2021 13:38:39 GMT -5
The company took Afrezza to market before superiority studies were done.. before accurate label was obtained.. also the SOC doesn't support what Afrezza can do.... We weren't able to educate docs on how to properly use Afrezza because there were so many things the label didn't allow us to say.. and it almost appeared that the company itself didn't understand Afrezza.. Docs are afraid of tighter control and seem to think an A1C of 7 is ok. Also didn't want the trouble of having to do spiro or learn something new unless they have to.. they are already so busy.. Insurance didn't want to cover a more expensive alternative if they didn't have to.. We are up against the status quo without a leg to stand on.. As was claimed it had nothing to do with Afrezza users not liking it.. that's just not true.. How would they even know if Afrezza was good when they didn't know how to use it in the first place.. or didn't know much about it and didn't have the support in the change.. I don't understand why you or anyone else would be so against Vdex. It appears to me they are growing.. and with telemedicine they can reach many more people.. it's just a waste of time to run down someone who is on our side no matter what the case is or turns out to be >>It appears to me they are growing Really, how would you know that? In any case how does their growth compare to the Top 100 endo prescribers, do you give them the benefit of the doubt and agree they might get better with Afrezza over time? Which of these two parties is more relevant? I claim the Top 100 endos filled 100 000´s prescriptions vs a completely unkown and likely a lot smaller number from Vdex, which then has the audacity to pay someone here to bash all doctors!
Am I wrong? Does pointing this out make me "against VDex"?
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Post by sportsrancho on Mar 16, 2021 14:08:48 GMT -5
Nobody pays me to post on here. I am paid to do social media ads on Instagram etc.
Our goal is blood sugar control/patient health, and to keep them on Afrezza so that they can relay a good experience.
It’s my opinion that that is bullish for shareholders.
I also post very bullish things on Twitter about Mannkind ...nobody pays me to do that either.
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Post by oldfishtowner on Mar 16, 2021 14:20:59 GMT -5
The company took Afrezza to market before superiority studies were done.. before accurate label was obtained.. also the SOC doesn't support what Afrezza can do.... We weren't able to educate docs on how to properly use Afrezza because there were so many things the label didn't allow us to say.. and it almost appeared that the company itself didn't understand Afrezza.. Docs are afraid of tighter control and seem to think an A1C of 7 is ok. Also didn't want the trouble of having to do spiro or learn something new unless they have to.. they are already so busy.. Insurance didn't want to cover a more expensive alternative if they didn't have to.. We are up against the status quo without a leg to stand on.. As was claimed it had nothing to do with Afrezza users not liking it.. that's just not true.. How would they even know if Afrezza was good when they didn't know how to use it in the first place.. or didn't know much about it and didn't have the support in the change.. I don't understand why you or anyone else would be so against Vdex. It appears to me they are growing.. and with telemedicine they can reach many more people.. it's just a waste of time to run down someone who is on our side no matter what the case is or turns out to be. I have pretty much tried to stay out of this debate about Vdex, because I think it is irrelevant to my investment in MNKD other than the period when Bill was trying to upend the company. I welcome Vdex contributing to scripts and doing what it can to educate both patients and prescribers about Afrezza. However I am not convinced that Vdex contribution has been all that significant. But what I think the real problem is the Vdex business model. There are plenty of diabetes clinics around the country who are Vdex's potential competitors. What differentiates Vdex from the rest of the crowd is Vdex's use and promotion of Afrezza.
The day that both the Cipla T2 trial and the pediatric phase 3 trial are completed and the medical community sees what we see and what Vdex sees and what Al Mann knew, Vdex's competitive advantage will melt away. It has probably 2 to 3 years to establish itself nationally as the leader in diabetic care.
MNKD potentially has a similar problem. Already we see BP developing DPI delivery technologies for their drugs. Then there is China, who is obviously trying to copy MNKD's technology. MNKD probably has a little longer than Vdex to grab market share before the real competition emerges.
We cannot change the past. We can only deal with the present to create the future.
Last year and the first quarter of this year MNKD has put a lot in place and more in motion to create that future. How all that plays out over this year and next remains to be seen. So we may still see a lot of volatility in the stock until there is more certainty in the outcomes, whether it is the pace of conversion of Tyvaso patients to the DPI version, the success of the clinical trials, whether Castagna is able to obtain partners for one or two pipeline products or partners who want DPI version of their own drugs, how many scripts will result from the Medicare part D next year, or what else Castagna is able to pull out of his hat. And MNKID has money in the bank, more than we have seen in a long long time.
My thought is that there is so much going on that it is difficult not to be at least moderately optimistic about the future, regardless of how Vdex fares.
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Post by sportsrancho on Mar 16, 2021 14:32:27 GMT -5
Very good points. Afrezza is not the focus at this point.
But Vdex could help Mannkind on getting the right dosing and using the right protocols for those trials. That would only help both companies.
We have business models without Afrezza in place....we prescribe other insulin and medication ..we are a blood sugar control clinic. Who’s flagship product is Afrezza. And we hope we can help Mannkind to keep it that way:-)
Right now I am excited about the submission of TrepT
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Post by sweedee79 on Mar 16, 2021 15:49:14 GMT -5
The company took Afrezza to market before superiority studies were done.. before accurate label was obtained.. also the SOC doesn't support what Afrezza can do.... We weren't able to educate docs on how to properly use Afrezza because there were so many things the label didn't allow us to say.. and it almost appeared that the company itself didn't understand Afrezza.. Docs are afraid of tighter control and seem to think an A1C of 7 is ok. Also didn't want the trouble of having to do spiro or learn something new unless they have to.. they are already so busy.. Insurance didn't want to cover a more expensive alternative if they didn't have to.. We are up against the status quo without a leg to stand on.. As was claimed it had nothing to do with Afrezza users not liking it.. that's just not true.. How would they even know if Afrezza was good when they didn't know how to use it in the first place.. or didn't know much about it and didn't have the support in the change.. I don't understand why you or anyone else would be so against Vdex. It appears to me they are growing.. and with telemedicine they can reach many more people.. it's just a waste of time to run down someone who is on our side no matter what the case is or turns out to be >>It appears to me they are growing Really, how would you know that? In any case how does their growth compare to the Top 100 endo prescribers, do you give them the benefit of the doubt and agree they might get better with Afrezza over time? Which of these two parties is more relevant? I claim the Top 100 endos filled 100 000´s prescriptions vs a completely unkown and likely a lot smaller number from Vdex, which then has the audacity to pay someone here to bash all doctors!
Am I wrong? Does pointing this out make me "against VDex"?
Do you know for a fact they aren't growing? I'll take Sports word for it... it's no skin off of my butt either way!!! I don't need to be negative about it or go on a rant... I can also support endos who are doing well with Afrezza !! I don't see anyone bashing ALL doctors.. My dad and I saw quite a few doctors.. and none of them understood Afrezza.. I saw what the problems were.. It seems to be a general theme heard from many.. I don't care to argue about it... It is what it is.. and I believe Vdex can help.. I like what I hear coming from them .. We have hope for the the future on many avenues.. time will tell.. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2021 16:05:01 GMT -5
>>It appears to me they are growing Really, how would you know that? In any case how does their growth compare to the Top 100 endo prescribers, do you give them the benefit of the doubt and agree they might get better with Afrezza over time? Which of these two parties is more relevant? I claim the Top 100 endos filled 100 000´s prescriptions vs a completely unkown and likely a lot smaller number from Vdex, which then has the audacity to pay someone here to bash all doctors!
Am I wrong? Does pointing this out make me "against VDex"?
Do you know for a fact they aren't growing? I'll take Sports word for it... it's no skin off of my butt either way!!! I don't need to be negative about it or go on a rant... I can also support endos who are doing well with Afrezza !! I don't see anyone bashing ALL doctors.. My dad and I saw quite a few doctors.. and none of them understood Afrezza.. I saw what the problems were.. It seems to be a general theme heard from many.. I don't care to argue about it... It is what it is.. and I believe Vdex can help.. I like what I hear coming from them .. We have hope for the the future on many avenues.. time will tell.. Sweedee you are 1000% correct with the SELF INFLICTED problems of Afrezza. Thats a hurdle Mike is trying to over come. The problem why investors have a bad taste in their mouth about VDEX is from the shenanigans they tried to pull a year ago. You don't try and strong arm a company to give you discounts to protect your own business and then demand a board seat. That's what wrankled my skin. They decided to get into this business as a clinic and they have to survive on their own. MNKD has no ownership in VDEX and therefore are not obligated to give them anything. You didn't see VDEX going after DXCM or Abbott for major discounts on their CGMs. |
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Post by sportsrancho on Mar 16, 2021 16:08:43 GMT -5
We closed a clinic in the high desert ...it was small inside another office. We were in negotiations to open it back up but negotiations had to wait till after Covid. Similar situations are pending.
But in the meantime we opened up Kentucky which is five times bigger than the clinic in the high desert, our revenue is way up, but that doesn’t concern Mannkind shareholders, that concerns our shareholders.
This is brought up by someone that wasn’t really keeping up on what was going on and mentioned me talking about Covid ..when I have every reason to know how these shut downs have hurt small businesses. Or at least postponed negotiations.
All good.. we’re coming out of it stronger and with happy patients.
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Post by sportsrancho on Mar 16, 2021 16:13:55 GMT -5
Discount on our CGM’s!!!! What in the world..we use the Libra.
Bad taste... it left a bad taste in our mouth when Mike squashed the Dubai deal! And then called us gangsters. I could go on if we want to bring all the stuff back up but I really don’t think we do.
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